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A union out of touch with its members

by Whaleoil on May 8, 2012

ᔥ The Telegraph

The teachers unions worldwide are not known for their intelligence. In the UK this is being shown up with the union opposing government plans to introduce performance pay for teachers. Three quarters of teachers agree, but the union is still opposed:

Teachers are backing plans to stop underperforming colleagues receiving pay rises as part of a drive to improve classroom standards, it emerged today.

More than three-quarters of school staff are in favour of linking salaries to performance in the classroom, figures show, despite widespread opposition to the move from unions.

Almost half of teachers questioned said pay rises should be determined by pupils’ results, it was revealed.

The disclosure – in a survey from the Sutton Trust charity – comes just days after it emerged that the Department for Education has written to the body charged with reviewing teachers’ salaries in England, asking it to strengthen the link between performance and pay.

MPs on the Commons Education Select Committee have also supported the move, saying that changes are needed to stop the worst teachers “hiding” behind a rigid national salary structure.
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  • Euan Rt

    Do only 25% of teachers in the UK belong to a union?

  • Rocknkid

    Omg teachers unions! Teachers get more holidays than anyone, work fewer hours, and still bleat on about how hard done by they are (I’m talking about primary school teachers). I know one who is always having time off for holidays in term time, as if they don’t get enough time off already! I like the performance pay idea

    • Kosh103

      Talking out your arse I see Rock.

      • Dion

        So school holidays are cancelled this year are they Kosh?  Those kids aren’t going to be happy with you when you walk into work tomorrow.  

      • Kosh103

        Oh look another know nothing right winger.

        Dion, just to make in clear for you, teachers work in the holidays. Yes, it is true, not all of the days, but only a very bad teacher works none or few of the holidays.

        A teacher like that I would have to question their dedacation to the kids.

  • Gavin

    Kosh I’ve been following this site for quite a while, I am neither right or left politically, but I’ve noticed that you never put facts up to back your argument and for a teacher if that’s what you are your spelling is atrocious. Why don’t you take a honest look at yourself and see if you are capable of doing better.

    • Kosh103

      Gavin, anytime I have been asked I have always backed up what I have said. Always.

      And if you dont think teachers work in the holidays, if you dont think teaching is one of the hardest jobs in the world, if you think teachers are in it to turn little minds into lefties then you are just as big a fool as all the other know nothing self appointed experts.

      And if this offends you – good.

      • TravisPoulson

        ”
        anytime I have been asked I have always backed up what I have said. Always.” 

        Another lie kosh. On a bit of a lying rampage this week eh?

        Gavin hit the nail on the head. 

      • Jester

        You need to contact the producers of The Deadliest Catch and Ice Road Truckers. I can see a huge opportunity for you Kosh.

      • Kosh103

        Oh look, trav is back telling more lies.

        Goodness trav you do keep busy dont you.

      • Kosh103

        Are those Tv shows or something Jester?

      • Jester

        Yes Kosh, both feature hard occupations.

        Obviously driving a fully loaded 16 tonne Kenworth over 8 inches of ice in sub zero temperatures for 36 hrs straight pales in significance to asking little Jimmy to remove the crayon from up his nose.

    • Kosh103

      Oh and if you want PROOF of how busy we can be – my nights work tonight is writing a report for the MoE and then another for the Uni of Auck. After that I will be going over some reading results to identify the next steps I need to focus on to help the kids.

      So please dont come on here and pretend you actualy know how hard teachers really work.

    • Dave

      Geez Gavin – you must have only been glancing occasionally to see that, No Facts Kosh. 

    • Roland

      My thoughts exactly, if I had you teaching my children, you would be the constant brunt of my derision. Typos excepted, heaven help the kids…Your grammar and spelling is year 6

      • Kosh103

        Roland if I was ever teaching your kids odds are you would be praising me.

        But I do not expect you to take the word of a leftie commie teacher.

  • Gravedodger

    Its spelt D E D I C A T I O N Kosh.
    A Teacher, really

  • Mark

    and should that be night’s work.. possessive pronoun perhaps?
    FFS, my 8 yr old can spell and punctuate better than Kosh, probably because her teachers embrace National Standards

    • Kosh103

      LMOA – I see you dont know whats actually in the NS. How typical.

  • Kosh103

    How typical.

    When the right wing are shown up as the know nothings they are they resort to spelling typos.

    Grav, Mark I say this with no respect – your idiots.

    • TravisPoulson

      ”
       your idiots.”

      Enough said kosh. You’ll be in China before sunrise digging at this rate.

      • Kosh103

        Only in your dreams trav.

  • Shaun

    Kosh

    You post a lot, and not everything you say is a lie (despite what some posters above think).  However, I’m often uncertain as to what you hope to achieve with many of your posts.  You often go straight to attack.I’m not sure who started it, I’ve not been around that long.  But you would come off looking a lot better if your first post in a thread was at least constructive.  Then if people wanted to sink to personal attacks – which would invariably happen – you would not look like a “angry lefty”.You’re doing the left no favours.  When people do show up on this blog, then I doubt you’ll be swinging them to towards the left.This is why I’m uncertain of what you hope to achieve, I’m almost at the point where I don’t think you’re even trying to convince others of your point of view.  The only other hypothesis I could come up with is that you’re here just to vent.ShaunPS:  I’m right leaning but most of my friends/family are left leaning.  I’m not judging your views, just questioning why you would keep posting here if all you get and give is aggression.

    • Shaun

      Hmmm, why do the paragraphs not show up, (except for the first one after the name)?  

      Anyway I’ll repost with // in the place of paragraph symbols. //

      You post a lot, and not everything you say is a lie (despite what some posters above think).  However, I’m often uncertain as to what you hope to achieve with many of your posts.  You often go straight to attack.  //  

      I’m not sure who started it, I’ve not been around that long.  But you would come off looking a lot better if your first post in a thread was at least constructive.  Then if people wanted to sink to personal attacks – which would invariably happen – you would not look like a “angry lefty”.  //  

      You’re doing the left no favours.  When people do show up on this blog, then I doubt you’ll be swinging them to towards the left. //  

      This is why I’m uncertain of what you hope to achieve, I’m almost at the point where I don’t think you’re even trying to convince others of your point of view.  The only other hypothesis I could come up with is that you’re here just to vent.  //  

      Shaun //  

      PS:  I’m right leaning but most of my friends/family are left leaning.  I’m not judging your views, just questioning why you would keep posting here if all you get and give is aggression.  //

    • Kosh103

      Oh this is a great place to vent thats for sure, and there are plenty on here who allow me to do so.

      I am not concerned if I am seen as an angry lefty by people on here, because frankly when it comes to this Govt I am.

      As for what I am hoping to achieve – nothing. Its a good place to have a chat, a rant, an all out cluster bomb blitz on the idiots of the right. All the things a leftist blog do not offer.

      I hope this has either cleared things up for you, or made the water so murky you cant see the bottom. :0D 

      • Shaun

        Heh, well that clears up my previously faulty assumption that you’re trying to convince others of your point of view.  

        Can’t say I fully understand an enjoyment of ranting, but then each to their own. 

      • Kosh103

        Most on here are too blind to have their minds changed.

        But when you see a right wing fool do something foolish, you still should point it out to them. They might keep doing it, but at least the truth is out there.

  • Greg M

    Kosh. I have learn’t a few things about disagreements over the years.

    1: Try to find out what you have in common
    2: Listen.
    3: be prepared to compromise for the greater good.

    Some observations I have made about you, If you don’t mind.
    ,
    1: Your dedication to children and their welfare and safety cannot be faulted, we have something in common.
    2: The party you support had 9 years to improve education standards and they did diddly squat.
    When people come on here and suggest alternatives, you lambast them, and won’t listen.
    How about you come up with some alternative solutions for us, rather than just being the” No” party ,like Labour.
    3: I agree with you that education professionals like prof Hattie and even the pinko Smythe almost certainly have a better idea of what is required than politicians.

    There, that wasn’t too difficult was it?

    Question: What has the union added to your career, and what have they done to help you to help the children that I know you genuinely care about?.

    Cheers G.

    • Kosh103

      1: Thank you.

      2: When they left office we had in place a world leading curr, and had consistently moved up the education ranks in the world. I wont say they did everything they could, but they did not damage education.
      I have suggested alternatives. Dump NS and base everything on the NZC. It is a far better set out document and its levels are not just slapped together and take into account how kids learn. National do everything around education based only on idiology, never on good sound educational studies. They lie about the number of kids failing in order to puch a one size fits all test based system -  and the right have the nerve to attack teachers and ignore the truth about what National do.

      3: Its a shame that the self appointed know it alls cannot accept that fact.

      4: The union have helped get more release time which allows teachers to keep on top (to a degree) with all the nonsese Wellington wants done. They have helped get more and more recognition for teachers who do extra duties. They have stood up to (and on more than one occasion stopped) bad policies that would harm childrens education – and that has been in regards to BOTH parties, despite the lies told. They have have helped keep our pay somewhat near to what it should be for what we do and taking into account the cost of living.

      There is more, but I have to dash for the moment. Feel free to ask more Q’s. Ill answer them as I get a chance.

      • Dave

        Kosh.

        I think your answers are straight BS or at best a one sided viewed through Rose Tinted glasses.    

        Like Greg, I value the education and welfare of children, as I think 99% of the population do.

        The World Leading Curriculum (WLC) you speak of, was actually a National Government initiative, sure, labour twitched it and finished the implementation, but taking credit for it, hmmmm      As Greg has suggested, try a link to the author of the WLC, or a quote on the minister/implementor.   

        A suggestion for you.   As a teacher, you are often judged by your writing style, yet you make your own abbreviations and spelling and grammar leave a lot to be desired.  Our 13yr old’s teacher is terrible at spelling and grammar as well. we now correct her typed newsletters and send them back.  Picky, but we can have 15 to 20 corrections on an A4 sheet.  Nowadays, spell and grammar checkers can correct 99.9% automatically.

        So, I suggest you type out your responses in Word or similar, and then copy and paste to this site.    That way, your credibility as a teacher is enhanced.

        As I have posted previously, my spelling is terrible, but I don’t earn a living from my spelling and grammar (I would be very poor and hungry if I did, especially with performance pay).    

      • Kosh103

        Dave I am not surprised you think my answers are BS. You are a right wing self appointed expert who thinks he knows more than those in the job.

        And from the rest of you comments, I see you are the type of parent who will be mocked behind your back.

      • Greg M

         Good answers, thank you. G.

  • AlanH

    I’ve been fascinated by the exchanges here, ranging from the politics of Ghengis Khan to Joseph Stalin.  What I can’t understand from Kosh is :
    Why would you protect bad teachers?
    Surely, in every industry, good work should reap reward?
    If you are a better teacher than the guy in the next classroom, don’t you think you should be paid more?  Or are you afraid you would be judged a lesser teacher and be paid less?
    This is the basis for the article from the UK : Success = reward.
    It’s true in every industry, so why not teaching?
    It’s not about how many hours you put in, but how effective you are at what you do.
    I have personal family experience of poor teaching and poor teachers, and am very grateful NS has been put in place so we can identify where our kids need extra help (i.e. where teachers are not teaching properly).  
    I do not need convincing that teaching is difficult, stressful, time consuming (even allowing for the school holidays which I know do not fully extend to teachers).  But is should also be rewarding, fulfilling and challenging.  HEY ! Sounds like a normal job!
    The bottom line is that you CHOSE to be a teacher, and unlike any other job you do not appear to be accountable for what you do.  It must be in the better interests of ALL teachers to weed out those who are not performing, and reward those who are.
    Teachers are there to teach our kids and equip them for their working future.
    They can only be judged on performance i.e. how many kids in their classrooms are passing exams. 

    • Kosh103

      I dont protect bad teachers. And in regard to performance pay -I have said before come up with a fair and accurate system that takes into account ALL the quirks teachers deal with and Ill support it.

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