Registration will protect the kids – Yeah Right

The Teachers Council, various teacher unions and the Labour party all claim that teacher registration should be mandatory…to protect the kids. It is their single biggest objection to charter schools.

Yet not a week goes by without a registered teacher being before the courts for fiddling with kids or some other ratbag crime. The Teachers Council also had to be dragged kicking and screaming towards transparency as they previously hid teachers names under a veil of secrecy.

Now the Herald on Sunday reveals that convicted pedophiles and sexual predators are still registered teachers

The predator of Pamapuria, James Parker, has been allowed to remain a registered teacher.

Hekia Parata, the Education Minister, is stepping in after the Herald on Sunday discovered Parker and two other high-profile sex offenders remain on the Teachers Council register. 

Andrew Ray Loader, the Otumoetai College teacher who paid $240 to twice watch teenagers have sex, was sentenced to 100 hours’ community work in March.

The only thing stopping his return to the classroom is that he has “voluntarily agreed” to stop teaching.

Douglas Haora Martin, former assistant principal of Lincoln High School, filmed up the skirts of 20 unsuspecting girls and women.

He pleaded guilty in January and was sentenced in April to 10 months’ home detention.

His practising certificate expired in April, but is still listed as active by the Teachers Council.

Time, I think, to disband the Teachers Council. They have shown themselves to be an instrument of the unions and pa protector of ratbags.

We cannot trust them any longer.

Parata said their inclusion on the register was a triumph of bureaucracy over common sense.

The news has surprised and angered those in the school community.

The Teachers Council maintains the register of teachers, which notes any disciplinary action taken. Teachers seriously sanctioned remain on the register with the words “cancelled” and “censured” beside their names – but not Parker, Loader and Martin. They are listed as having full registration. The council’s director, Peter Lind, is overseas and didn’t comment, but a spokesman said it took time and “due process” for teachers to be deregistered.

Time for Hekia Parata to step up and axe this bunch of morons.

  • Col

    Shane Jones could fit in nicely with the Teachers Council.

  • le sphincter

    So open slather and having any freak walk in front of the classroom is a far better system ?

    Its not perfect but its better than laissez faire

    • Bunswalla

      Remarkably stupid comment, even by your low standards. If the teachers employed by Charter Schools are “freaks”, what would you call these registered teachers above?

      • Ronnie Chow

        Sphincter was taught but never learned . Now he feels , and indeed is , left out of adult debate . I would pity him if he wasn’t such an arsehole .

    • mike

      Teachers in charter schools will need to be qualified… they will not be required to be registered. Big difference…

      Charter schools will also be picky about who they employ as they only want the best people they can get… much like any other company who wants to turn a profit.

  • Orange

    You cannot reform something so broken and corrupt. Disband it and build something new from the ground up that is going to work.

  • peterwn

    The Teachers Council pointed out earlier Parker would not be in a position to teach for a long time, so there was no hurry in his case. Perhaps legislation could be amended if need be to allow the Council or its Chief Executive to temporarily suspend a teacher so the roll can be annotated immediately. In such cases the onus should be on such a teacher to argue that he/se should not be suspended. Fair is fair – schools in serious cases (and in not so serious cases) suspend kids first then haul them before the Board later. This would be a satisfactory outcome.

    • le sphincter

      Yes must get going to prevent a guy in jail for 18 years from teaching before the end of the year.
      Like most of these things they probably have quarterly meetings

      • SJ00

        Considering it was arrested over a year ago, there have been 4 meetings he could have had his name removed (assuming they have quarterly meetings) but heres an idea, hold a special fucking meeting and delete his name off their database. It takes 5 minutes to do that. If he wants to cry he isn’t on the list, let him.

        Basically you don’t mind having a list of crims and perverts alongside decent teachers?

        • wanarunna

          I don’t give a toss whether his name is on the register or not, I am more interested in whether he can teach or not. Some record in a database somewhere isn’t going to change the risk he poses to school children. He’s locked up for fucks sake.
          No-one has ever indicated that his name won’t get removed, it has never been suggested that it won’t. It just hasn’t happened yet.

          • SJ00

            We all know the only people he will be teaching for the next 20 years are fellow crims. But thats fine, according to you, to let his name stay on the register for… how long? Your logic dictates it can stay on there as long as he isn’t in a position to teach kids. We all know that having your name on there has nothing to do with if you will be teaching or not. But its a list of registered teachers that is full of crims, perverts and deviants. Its what it represents. If you were a teacher, would you be proud to have your name alongside James Parker and these other idiots? No. So get his fucking name off their yesterday.

          • wanarunna

            How long? As long as it reasonably takes to follow the procedure set out in the Education Act which they have no choice but to follow.
            And if I was a teacher, I think I would measure pride in terms of achievements with the kids I was teaching, not whether or not James Parker’s name was still on the Register. As if the day his name is removed all right minded teachers in New Zealand are going to heave a collective sigh of relief and simultaneously think to themselves that at last they can be proud…..give me a fucking break.
            My profession also has a register of people who can practice, and people who, like James Parker, demonstrated that they do not deserve to be on the register, will inevitably be removed from it. The process to remove someones name takes time. This is just how it is. In the meantime we just get on with our work un-purturbed by the fact that our former colleague’s name still appears on some web site somewhere, content in the knowledge that the sideways glances he now gets from Bubba in the prison canteen are giving him more shits than are to be found in the dysentery ward at Delhi hospital.

          • wanarunna

            How long? As long as it reasonably takes to follow the procedure set out in the Education Act which they have no choice but to follow.
            And if I was a teacher, I think I would measure pride in terms of achievements with the kids I was teaching, not whether or not James Parker’s name was still on the Register. As if the day his name is removed all right minded teachers in New Zealand are going to heave a collective sigh of relief and simultaneously think to themselves that at last they can be proud…..give me a fucking break.
            My profession also has a register of people who can practice, and people who, like James Parker, demonstrated that they do not deserve to be on the register, will inevitably be removed from it. The process to remove someones name takes time. This is just how it is. In the meantime we just get on with our work un-purturbed by the fact that our former colleague’s name still appears on some web site somewhere, content in the knowledge that the sideways glances he now gets from Bubba in the prison canteen are giving him more shits than are to be found in the dysentery ward at Delhi hospital.

    • Orange

      Helen Clark is the Prime Minister of New Zealand.

  • wanarunna

    one of the more stupid stories I have seen for a long time. For fucks sake, the pervert is locked up, and as le sphincter says, isn’t in any position to teach. The article itself states that “Only the Disciplinary Tribunal can remove a teacher from the register, and only once the complaints assessment committee has investigated.”. If the Disciplinary Tribunal held a hearing, and let him continue to hold his ticket, that would be a story. This however is just a pathetic attempt at journalism. There is no fucking way this guy is going any where near a class room for the rest of his (hopefully short) life, so the fact that the Disciplinary Tribunal hasn’t been through the process yet is of absolutely no consequence.

    • Bunswalla

      One of the more stupid comments I’ve seen for a long time. Sure, Parker’s in jail for a long time, but what if these dipshits and arse-coverers forget to remove him? What possible value can the “complaints assessment committee” add to a decision whether to keep him on the register? Are they going to say we’re too harsh to judge, that he was abused as a child, that he didn’t get enough hugs? FFS he pleaded guilty to 75 charges and he’s in jail. What possible reason could there be to keep him registered?

      And what about the other two – Loader and Martin? Both still registered, and neither with any comments on their record. Loader could start teaching again any time he chose, and if somebody checked with the Teacher’s Protection Racket, sorry, I mean Council, they would have to say “no adverse comments” and good luck to the kids.

      • wanarunna

        “but what if these dipshits and arse-coverers forget to remove him? ”
        Did you write the original article? With that sort of comment I wouldn’t be surprised. If they forget to remove him, then sure, write an article about it. But comments like that are just nonsense. You may as well have posted condemning the justice system immediately after he pleaded guilty asking “what if they forget to sentence him……”
        As for the other two, there is nothing in the article that gives us any clue as to where the respective disciplinary processes are at. For all we know everthing has been done bar the update of the web site.
        Douglas Martin’s practicing certificate has expired, so he can’t teach. He can only renew it if he has had a satisfactory Police vet in the past 3 years. This may be a loophole – ie if he had a satisfactory vet before his crimes came to light, and within the past three years, then he could argue he satisfies the criteria to be issued with a practicing certificate. Otherwise he can’t get it renewed. If that was the case, sure, write a story about it.

    • SJ00

      This isn’t the fucking baseball hall of fame or a watchlist, its a register of teachers that I presume are fit to teach. Whether or not they are teaching, or are likely to be teaching, its symbolic more than anything. Yeah lets have a list that is full of pedos and criminals and perverts amongst the *good* teachers.
      The List:
      Andrew Ray Loader – sexual pervert and deviant
      Mr Logan – a good teacher
      Douglas Haora Martin – sexual pervert and deviant
      Mr Matthews – a good teacher we think
      James Parker – 75 convictions for fiddling kids
      Mr Smith – innocent so far – good to teach

      Brilliant. Take his fucking name off the register yesterday to at least show you give a flying fuck. Who cares if he isn’t going to be able to teach for 20 years, he is in jail for fiddling with kids and shouldn’t be on the fucking list with real, decent teachers.

      • wanarunna

        The point is, there is a process that by law they have to go through to get him removed. They are working through the process. With Parker they waited till he was sentenced to get the process underway so the Judge’s sentencing notes could be used in evidence before the Tribunal rather than getting the kids to testify again, putting them through more trauma.
        This knee jerk reaction is bullshit. I am not saying Parker should be allowed to stay on the register, I am just pointing out that there is a process that needs to be gone through to remove his name, by all accounts that is happening, and in the meantime the fact that his name is still on the register does not translate to a risk to children by virtue of him getting a teaching job somewhere.
        Like I said, if at the end of the disciplinary process they decide to keep his name on the register, than that is a story.
        This isnt’.

        • Nechtan

          If they decide to keep his name? FFS any teacher convicted of crimes against children should be automatically removed from the register permanently. How could the council decide otherwise?

          • dyannt

            Agreed. Once someone is convicted by the courts it only needs an administrator to remove the name. It doesn’t need a meeting of the whole board.
            And no one has mentioned the message it’s sending to the victims and their parents when they find out the perpetrator is still registered.
            Remove the name immediately there is a conviction. Let him challenge that action if he feels he has been hard done by.

          • wanarunna

            Thats not what the Education Act says. What you say makes perfect sense in terms of what the law should say, but it doesn’t say that, and it isn’t up to some administrator working for the Teachers Council to decide to make changes to the Register based on what they think the law should say, rather than what it does say.

          • Orange

            It is what the Education Act says. The Teachers Council does not have to go through any disciplinary committees etc etc. That’s an option, but another option is to just do it. That’s in black and white in law. They just need to tell them they are doing that (which is obvious) and expect to view their response (which was obviously given in a jolly big court trial).

          • wanarunna

            You miss my point entirely. If they decide to give him a medal, that would justify story for the paper too, but I didn’t say it was going to happen, and it won’t.

            As it happens, the law requires them to go through a process in order to remove his name from the Register. They have started the process, but they haven’t finished it. Whats the fucking problem? He can’t teach, he can’t get near kids, and as you point out, how can the Teachers Council decide other than to remove his name? But for fucks sake, let them go through the process to remove it legally and in a manner that can’t be challenged, rather than insisting that some administrator with access to the database take it upon themselves to break the law.

          • Orange

            They decide how to remove it legally. They could do it tomorrow if they wanted. They don’t want to. They want endless bureaucracy that keeps them employed. It’s not about protecting kids at all.

          • wanarunna

            No they don’t. They have to follow the process set out in sections 139AQ et seq of the Education Act 1989.

          • Orange

            No they don’t. 122 and 129 covers it fine.

          • wanarunna

            what about 129(2)? Doesn’t that require them to have a hearing?

          • Orange

            These are full teachers being discussed so no. 129(1) is fine. They are just time wasting bureaucrats.

          • wanarunna

            Don’t follow you. s129(2) applies when considering whether to cancel registration of any teacher or authorised persons limited authority pursuant to section 129 (1) (a) or (b).

          • Orange

            Ah yes, I thought you meant 129(1)a2. With respect to 129(2) my other comment elsewhere holds. You don’t think one year is a bit too reasonable?

          • wanarunna

            I think that so long as the pervert is locked up, there is no reason for the Teachers Council to depart from the normal disciplinary procedure set out out in the Act when by doing so they are making absolutely no difference to the crucial question which is whether or not there is any danger of the bloke getting a teaching job somewhere.
            If you and others are offended by the fact his name is still on the register that is only because you are inferring that just because his name is still there, the Teachers Council think he is a great bloke and should be back in the class room.
            There is nothing more stupid than being offended or making judgements based on what you think that other people think.

          • Orange

            Have you not seen the report on the Teachers Council? It’s pretty obvious that the normal procedure is buggered. As for your adhominem, bleh, I think I’ve tried to avoid that.

        • Orange

          I think you’re missing the point. They invented the process which clearly is an ass. They have to go.

          • wanarunna

            Are you saying that the current Teachers Council membership wrote the Education Act?

          • Orange

            I’m saying they choose how to enforce it. But yes, what they decide goes, take the permanent suppression thing. Take the enquiry. Take the list which isn’t up to date despite criminal findings which automatically disqualify.

        • John Phillips

          I totally agree with wanarunna on this. But the simpletons and career witch-hunters are so easily inflamed by petty media-led points that don’t actually matter much, and which have no effect whatsoever on the core issue.

  • Andy

    Nice slogan for their website
    NZ Teachers Council, Protecting kiddy fiddlers since 2002

  • Ronnie Chow

    “a spokesman said it took time and “due process” for teachers to be deregistered”

    That smells like a cover-up , a moral failure and incompetence all in one sentence . Fucking liar that spokesman .

  • John Phillips

    Its a matter of admin, that’s all. Whether or not a name is removed quickly or belatedly won’t make one scrap of difference to safety in schools. Quite obviously none of those who have been convicted if molestation will ever teach in a state school again, regardless of the register. You would think otherwise if you are silly enough to take media reports at face value.

    • SJ00

      Well in that case, lets just leave his name on there then. Who cares as long as he is behind bars and can’t teach, the kids and the schools are safe. In fact, lets leave all the bad teachers on the list. Saves some poor teachers council plonker having to hit delete.

      And wasn’t that fat fucker who faked his identity and went on to teach in about 8 schools deregistered? I’m pretty sure he was convicted but was able to teach in schools again.

      • John Phillips

        Not what I am saying at all.

      • Bunswalla

        Yes, good point. So “quite obviously they …. will never teach on a state school again” means nothing.

  • Fat Sally

    I think the real crime is putting the registration fee up from $100 to $220 with no explanation as to why? I guess it was used to pay off the millions of dollars worth of debt it has clocked up.

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