The anti-smacking law a resounding success. /Tui ad

Let’s see where Marika Hill is taking this attempt at breathing life into another outrage corpse

Supporters of the controversial “anti-smacking” law are claiming victory after a dramatic fall in the number of parents being investigated for hitting their children.

But opponents of the 2007 law change have accused the Government of fudging the numbers and the issue looks set to become an election lightning rod, with the Conservative Party, a potential Government coalition partner, committed to overturning the legislation.

The amendment to section 59 of the Crimes Act in 2007 removed the defence of “reasonable force” for parents prosecuted for assault on their children.

It divided the country, with its sponsor, former Green MP Sue Bradford, receiving death threats while Family First director Bob McCroskie, an opponent of the change, found plastic knives stabbed into his lawn.

Opponents of the law change claimed “good parents” would be prosecuted for disciplining children and it would do nothing to stop serious harm to children.

Unnamed “supporters” of anti smacking legislation.   Come on now Marika.  Did you interview your keyboard or are you doing a favour for a friend here?  

Police say they have prosecuted just eight parents for smacking children in the five years since the law came in. Seven of those parents had smacked their child in the head or face.

The eighth parent was discharged without conviction for striking the child on the hand. Police said they were also being called to fewer smacking incidents though they stopped counting smacking prosecutions after the Government’s five-year review process came to an end.

Bradford said the dramatic drop in notifications proved parents were turning their back on smacking. “This is what those of us involved in the heart of the struggle expected. That dreadful witch hunt and crazy campaign that went on at the time, none of it’s come true.

“Anecdotally, I have so many adults who said what a lesson [the law] was. They say: ‘I used to think I had to hit my kids because my parents did’.”

Bradford fears a “nightmare” scenario where Craig holds bargaining power: “Heaven forbid, if Colin Craig becomes influential in the next Government.

“I think it leaves [Prime Minister] John Key in some difficulty. It would be dreadful to see him [Craig] and his party with the power to strongly influence a National-led Government.”

Aha.  As I suspected, complete has-been and professional protester Sue Bradford’s been in your ear with “anecdotal evidence”.

I love how Marika is allowing Bradford a platform to try and reignite an election issue that isn’t anything more than grandstanding and something else much more disturbing.

The something else being the disgusting attempt at trying to rewrite history.

Observers may recall Bradford wanted anti-smacking introduced to stop the disgusting and sickening number of children that are killed by their family and hangers-on in New Zealand each year.

But now the legislation is a victory that “only” 8 smacking cases got to court?

Marika Hill only has to do a search on her own newspaper database to see how well anti-smacking legislation is protecting New Zealand’s children

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and

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and

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Look into those eyes Sue Bradford.  Are you really proud of how your anti-smacking legislation is protecting these children from their extended families?

Trying to reignite a political career over the bodies of dead children is disgusting enough.

Yet the same media outlet that ‘choose not to name’ the mother of the 9 year old drunk boy are a willing vehicle for celebrating the questionable success of legislation that is now being measured on conviction rates of parents that smack kids, while ignoring all the murdered babies filling up our cemeteries.

  • opusx

    Bradford is a fucking moron of the highest order. Her law change has done nothing…I repeat…NOTHING.

    • Blueballs

      Her law change has changed me.
      Before it i would have never contemplated hitting a woman or child.
      Now i would like nothing better than to punch her squarly in her ugly face.

      • jaundiced

        Sue Bradford brings out ugly fucking morons like you. Get over it – the sky didn’t fall in. I was brought up on ‘you just wait ’till your father gets home’, but the prospect of a good beating just made me cunning and resentful.

        I had to learn new ways to deal with my own kids. It took time and patience but the thought of hitting my own kids, or grand-kids now is just ridiculous.

        Here’s a thought. As your parents get old they may, depending on their state of mind, become more like children. They will ‘mis-behave’ e.g throw their food on the floor. With a toddler you may give them a smack. Would you do the same to your parent? The argument for and against would be the same, but in the case of the parent you’ll be thinking about respect and dignity, how it would make them feel, as well as the likely impact on their behaviour. It may have an effect, but because they’ll be afraid of you.

        By the way, there’s no such thing as a ‘loving smack’ that’s a term used by bat-shit crazy Christians.

        • Other_Andy

          I was with you most of the way, until the last sentence.

          • Orange

            He prefers the alternative of psychological warfare and verbal abuse.

          • Kimbo

            What?!

            Marriage?

          • Orange

            Eww, that’s illegal and wrong man.

        • Blueballs

          You have completey missed the thrust of my comment, i don’t smack my kids, nor would i abuse my parents in a rest home, i simply would like to punch sue bradford squarly in the face

          • jaundiced

            ‘I simply would like to punch sue bradford squarly in the face.’

            I think I’ve got the thrust of your comment.

            Lets just take a breath.

        • Other_Andy

          “By the way, there’s no such thing as a ‘loving smack’ that’s a term used by bat-shit crazy Christians”

          By the way…
          Not having hard facts it would be difficult to verify but I have a feeling that most of the perpetrators of (real) child abuse (Some extreme examples above) are not ‘rightwing’ “bat-shit crazy Christians’ but ‘leftwing’ Labour-Mana-Maori party supporters.

        • LesleyNZ

          Yes there is such a thing as a loving smack.

          • jaundiced

            Tui billboard

          • IntrinsicValue

            No, just common sense. If you don’t want to smack your children, then don’t. But the sky won’t fall in (to quote your silly remark earlier) if I smack mine.

          • Col

            I have 3 children, the first 2 may have had say 3 smacks, they remember them, my third has never had a smack and should have, a loving smack as I see it and what it does to me, I feel worse than them, it hurts me more, and I mean that, but my kids are ok and love me as I love them. I got smacked, made me think twice.

          • Bad__Cat

            In that case is it OK to give the missus a “loving smack” too?
            If not, why not?

          • IntrinsicValue

            No, because our responsibility of parents is to protect our children and to raise socially responsible and law abiding citizens. Sometimes that requires discipline of various kinds. Adults are not part of that social structure.

          • David Tocker

            That’s pretty much the same argument as “I have a car license, why shouldn’t I be able to drive a truck? They are the same thing!”

          • LesleyNZ

            The Missus is already grown up so that is not a valid argument. The child is growing up and has to learn how to behave and what the boundaries are. This is called discipline. Time out does not always work. Pleading with the kid to stop does not work.

        • IntrinsicValue

          I agree with you…the thought of hitting my children is also ridiculous. Smacking, on the other hand, is something entirely different.

  • Dan

    Another seriously black mark against John Key and his socialists.

  • Other_Andy

    “I think it leaves [Prime Minister] John Key in some difficulty. It would be dreadful to see him [Craig] and his party with the power to strongly influence a National-led Government.”
    Oh yes that would be dreadful.
    Having a Labour government supported by the Marxist ‘Greens’ and fascist Mana is OK but linking up with a party that wants to get rid of an unpopular law is dreadful.
    Only in the alternate world Marika lives in.

  • cows4me

    Go Colin stick it up the liberal busy bodies. The law and it’s supporters are life’s failures, like all lefties and their wish to control everyone’s lives this law was camouflaged with copious amounts of good intentions. It’s got nothing to do with protecting children it’s about liberal fascists imposing their will upon others. It was bad law five years ago, it’s still bad law now.

    • ropteron

      Good post Cows.
      ;)

    • jaundiced

      You have to question the mentality of someone whose driving force to get into a position of power is to restore the abilty to hit children.

      • cows4me

        Not at all. As I have stated this law isn’t about protecting children it’s about making society conform to the rules and regulations of the so called progressive. For the record jaundiced I don’t hit or “smack, FFS” my children, what I do believe is that I don’t have the right to tell you how to bring up your children. Something many on the left struggle with.

        • Col

          As far as I see this law it was to stop the so called abuse towards children, but how much before was happening, same as now?
          It sure hasn’t stop killing babies, so throwing them at the wall, dropping them on there head is ok, not.

          • Bad__Cat

            That’s like saying increasing the penalties for common assault would stop all murders. It doesn’t figure.

          • IntrinsicValue

            The promoters of the anti smacking legislation sold their case on the basis of child abuse data. Unless child abuse has declined, the legislation has failed.

        • motorizer

          yeah and remember that so many on the left hate kids.

          they choose not to have them.

          they really like to push abortion.

      • Muffin

        I believe it’s more about restoring the right of parents to do what they see fit over what the state sees fit.

        • jaundiced

          I understand that. How do you feel when you see a van-load of kids unrestrained in the back seat?

          • Muffin

            Darwinism

          • Mr_Blobby

            The same when I see overweight, no lets call it what it is, fat parents sitting in the front and the kids in the back with a big bag of chips and a 1.25 liter bottle of coke.

            The stupid will always be with us regardless of what we do.

          • David Tocker

            There is actually a law against that, has been for quite some time. Home goal?

      • WABloke

        Hitting and smacking are different things in most peoples eyes.

        • jaundiced

          I know – calling it something else makes it sound different.

          • WABloke

            Whatever.

          • motorizer

            yep damn fuckin straight whatever.

          • justin

            Yep kids that get a smack are not little shits hitting other kiddies.

          • jaundiced

            Justin – most people here don’t get sarcasm

          • motorizer

            do you really see no difference? why have the two words evolved separately? can you seriously tell me that you have reached adult hood and do not understand the difference? if that is the case then you are seriously seriously out of touch with reality. if you cant look at a child who is beyond being told off with words (do you need me to type an extreme real life example?) and think to yourself “that child needs a smack” and see do difference with thinking “that child needs to be hit” then YOU are whats wrong with society. YOU are the type of person this legislation is written for. why dont you use your brain when you argue your point instead of emotional blackmail. You show your novice on the subject sweetie.

          • jaundiced

            No, sorry. Can’t tell the difference, That’s why I don’t do it.

            Here’s a thought – next time you see a kid that can’t be reasoned with, instead of thinking ‘that child needs a smack’ try thinking ‘that kid needs a hug’. :)

          • motorizer

            what like when a kids goes to run across the road in peekhour because mum is busy with putting the shopping in the car? or the kid that pulls out something theyve stolen from the shop out of their pocket when they get home? or the 8year old that pushes his 3 year old brother into the pool and nearly drowns him? or the kid that keeps playing with the oven knobs repeatedly every day? hey my kids dont do any of that stuff but i can at least comprehend that im more fortunate than others. YOU are not considering that other people have tougher lives than yourself.

          • jaundiced

            Yep, understand and see you’re a good parent. Even with these occasions…
            And I’m not a novice and know about tough parenting

        • Bad__Cat

          Not if they ore done “with love”

  • Liberty

    We have to keep in mind the Government changed in 2008. The
    police have taken the hint
    from the Beehive. The law has to be applied with care.

    But what would have happen if the sisters were still in charge. This was spiteful Government that had the police trawling the law
    books for months to persecute some poor chap for sedition.
    Because he pissed of Dear Leader. It had the smell of Stalinism.

    Society as we know it would have been very different if the sisters had been allowed to continue with their vile social engineering.

  • Pissedoffyouth

    My mum only used the spatula on me a couple of times.

    Normally she’d be cunning and do the old Chili sauce or mustard toothbrush

    • cows4me

      She probably got sick of you doing burnouts on the driveway.

    • LesleyNZ

      Thank goodness you had a loving sensible mum. You could have turned out to be one of those spoilt brats who think the world revolves around them.

    • WABloke

      Good on ya mum. Mine used a wooden spoon on the bum or back of the legs, dad used his hand. Neither of them beat us (that I can recall) and they managed to do a reasonable job on the six of us.

      I occasionally smacked my kids on the bum (without a weapon) when they were little but from memory it was all over and done with before they got to school. With my German Shepherd pup I occasionally used a rolled up newspaper (it was always the same one) on the rump and it wasn’t long before I only had to pick it up before he got the message that when I said ‘come’ or ‘sit’ I meant it. It’s the same methodology/result with children.

      After a couple of months of training the pup the newspaper became redundant. A bit like the Herald really.

    • Dave

      Oh God, i hope your not scarred for life POY, a few smacks, and the Chilli toothbrush…. Would it help if we organised for Sue Bradford to pop round and give you a cuddle??

      • Pissedoffyouth

        She would be the last person except for Darion

    • LesleyNZ

      What is the recipe for mustard toothpaste? And how do you dish out the Chilli sauce?

  • ol’ sole

    Did I not read somewhere recently that the Scandinavian countries (or some of them) are now regretting talking the course they have regarding banning smacking. They have realised that it is not working and they now have a generation of kids who don’t give a shit. I wish I could find it – I would post it.

    • jaundiced

      If smacking is the answer, then lets bring back corporal punishment in schools. You’d all be OK if teachers were allowed to biff your kids? I’m sure Colin Craig will support you on that. As I said, bat-shit crazy

      • Mr_Blobby

        Yes you are bat-shit crazy, now move along, or my I speak plainly fuck off.

        • jaundiced

          Fuck you asshole

        • Bad__Cat

          As a parent, I think his arguments make sense, and don’t merit your abuse.
          Struck a nerve, did he?

      • Bad__Cat

        Only if the teachers smack them “with love”

      • motorizer

        so you not only dont know the difference between hitting and smacking but you also dont differentiate between disciplining ones own child and having a (in most cases especially if they are registered) total stranger, being the teacher administer punishment.

        have a look at my previous comments if you have the guts and you’ll see i dont often write such lengthy tyrades. but for you i have to make an exception. your deluded.

        • jaundiced

          So smacking is.Ok but only if parents do it, and as long as you don’t call it hitting. Oh, and you do it lovingly

          Thanks for explaining – I get it now

          • motorizer

            oh good. thanks for playing.

  • motorizer

    For me the fact of the matter is that there are laws already in place and all that left leaning parties do is cloud the water and make the police’s job as well as the courts far more difficult therefore crating more uncertainty and creating more public service jobs therefore the redistribution of wealth the oldest socialist way. Its a fuckin farce.

  • wiltinpenis

    The only “nightmare” in Bradford’s life is staring at her in the mirror.

    • Alfred12

      Isn’t she related to Fenton? Twin sisters perhaps?

  • greg

    The Brownise community hasn’t heard this!

  • thor42

    Like so many laws that attempt to “ban” things, this law has done nothing except drive smacking “underground” – behind closed doors.

    Also – like so many laws put forward by *socialists* – this law has its main effect on those who are *least-likely* to be a danger to their children. Those who are a real danger to their children won’t give a shit about this law – they will punch and pound and belt their kids *regardless* of the law.

  • DangerousE

    Personally i’m pleased by the outcome from this, we all know it was never going to stop those mongrels who bash there babies to death. A bit like gun legislation doesn’t stop criminals using guns. However I think it has had an unintended consequence an Overton window if you like, we have moved some parents into area of more responsibility, by making them think of better ways to raise children. Sure they’re still behind the 8 ball, but at least going in the right direction. While not a fan of legislating responsibility, I don’t see any good reversing it. I do think society as a whole could do a hell of a lot better at raising our children and it could start with being truthful.

  • LesleyNZ

    I wonder if Sue Bradford’s journalist daughter Katy Bradford is able to be objective when she is required to report on this subject.

    • jaundiced

      At least as objective as he comments on this post.

      Anyway, its not a political issue. I’m not a leftie, and I despise the Greens, but if parents now pause before they hit their kids – even if only when they’re in public then that’s a good thing and will hopefully lead to a change in attitude over time (remember when pubs were full of smoke?)

      Spoilt brats aren’t just the result of not being smacked, but kids who are physical bullies at school and even early childhood centres are almost certainly a result of their role models who see physical violence (thats what smacking is) as a normal response.

      • LesleyNZ

        A smack when young works – reason does not. Smacking is a not a beating or abuse. Stats/evidence please to back up what you believe. “Spoilt brats aren’t just the result of not being smacked, but kids who are physical bullies at school and even early childhood centres are almost certainly a result of their role models who see physical violence (thats what smacking is) as a normal response.”
        Spoilt brats are result of being indulged and allowed to do what they like when they like, and get what they like and say what they like with no boundaries.

        • jaundiced

          You talk as though smacking is the only solution. Its not – it has short term impact and doesn’t require as much patience, but its not the only effective solution

          • LesleyNZ

            It is not the only solution but is effective for certain behaviour. Do you have children?

          • jaundiced

            I do. I was smacked as a child, and that was my own instinct at first, but made a conscious decision to change strategy (not because of the law). Tried ‘time out’ for misbehavior and works brilliantly if used consistently. Wouldn’t now dream of hitting our gentle angel

          • Bad__Cat

            Ditto. I used to smack my daughter until I learned how to raise her without violence. We both gained from that.

            And yes, I define striking someone to cause pain as violence.

    • Dave

      Lesley, please wash your mouth out with soap for even thinking that. Daughter seems intelligent, but she must be tarred with the family brush. Poor thing!

      • LesleyNZ

        Just asking……………….

  • WABloke

    You’re on the money once again Cam.

  • Mr_Blobby

    That will be hard for National.

    1. They supported the legislation in the first place, entrenching it.
    2. They ignored a referendum supported by a massive majority to repeal it.
    3. They squashed a bill to repeal it, probably because they had helped entrench it.
    4. They wont admit that it has had zero effect on our child abuse statistics.
    5. They wont admit that it has criminalized otherwise good parents.

    So my best guess is that we are stuck with another piece of useless legislation.

  • Tom

    Someone should ask good old Sue about her parenting skills and how her son got off the rape charge. Yup you’re a fucking legend Sue.

    • island time

      It was 2010 and he was acquitted of rape charges. Reported in stuff.co.nz.

  • Night Stick

    So what hours of arguing on here has proved – the beatings (as opposed to a smack) have continued unabated and the ferals still kill their kids. Out of control children plague our schools and even teachers are pulling their hair out with frustration. Thanks Sue, your social engineering has worked out as planned, that is to keep the law abiding parents subdued whilst the sub cultures enjoy status quo.

  • KP

    Don’t beat them in the face and make them ugly… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abuEX3fzloQ

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