Whaleoil General Debate

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keep-calm-and-don-t-shoot-the-messenger-3Morning everyone, and welcome to Whaleoil’s daily General Debate post (another one called Backchat will start at 6pm). To participate you’ll need to register a free Disqus account.

There are some rules, and if there is one thing about Whaleoil that you need to know is that these rules are dispassionately and strictly enforced.

  • Korau

    Just how healthy is Hillary Clinton? How long standing have been the health problems?

    1. A “potentially fatal” blood clot in 1998.
    2. February 1, 2005: Clinton faints during campaign speech.
    3. June 17, 2009: A massive elbow fracture.
    4. 2009: A second blood clot, “deep vein thrombosis.”
    5. January 12, 2011: Clinton stumbles boarding plane.
    6. December 15, 2012: The concussion
    7. December 31, 2012: The third blood clot.
    8. January 24, 2013: Fresnel lenses to prevent “seeing double.”
    9. May 14, 2014: Bill says the recovery took six months.
    10. July 31, 2015: Bardack’s letter and statement.
    11. October 22, 2015: A coughing fit at the Benghazi hearing.
    12. February 16, 2016: Coughing fit in New York.
    13. July 21, 2016: A seizure on camera?!
    14. September 5, 2016: Another coughing fit on stage.
    15. September 9, 2016: Diagnosed with pneumonia.
    16. September 11, 2016: The fainting and final release of information.

    It’s easy to see why Donald Trump has seized on the “Fragile Hillary” theme, and also if Hillary continues why this will be a continuing albatros around her campaign’s neck.

    There are endless column inches being consumed by her health, or lack of it.

    See more from the above list here : https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/09/13/15-episodes-of-hillary-clinton-health-problems/?singlepage=true

    • Nige.

      Fox reporting several unflattering comments make by Colin Powell about the unelectability of Clinton and what Bill is STILL engaged with at home with “bimbos”

      • Damon Mudgway

        The fact is you just can’t trust a single thing coming out of the mouths of the Clintons. They really are deplorable people.

    • Duchess of Pork

      Perhaps it’s time Madeleine Allbright stepped in and advised Hillary to stand down and look after her own health instead of carrying on the burden of electioneering when clearly unwell. There must be a special place in hell for women that don’t support each other like this when required.

  • Kevin

    It seems that double standards and lying are hallmarks of the Left.

    The latest is the Craig case and the Left putting their support behind Craig despite the allegations of sexual harassment and generally being a dodgy deadbeat boss (including support by people who call themselves feminists).

    It may seem surprising at first but it’s not really. The Left have always been all talk and have only been about fighting for the poor, the disenfranchised, and the oppressed only when it suits them – when it’s more advantageous or they gain to lose less by supporting the persecutor they will every single time – from Muslim vs gay to a woman vs someone they want to see go down.

    And when they gain power it’s always the poor that suffer the most while they stuff their pockets. Venezuela is just the latest example of that but others are the USSR and the Palestinian Authority.

    Anyway more ammunition for us. Any self-declared “feminist” who has put their weight behind Craig and continues to put their weight behind Craig deserves to have their hypocrisy exposed and to be ridiculed without mercy,

  • XCIA

    Listened to Labours list MP Carmel Sepuloni this morning trying to justify her stance as to why the taxpayer should continue to fund the lifestyle of some 14,000 solo parents who will not identify the fathers of their illegitimate children. I would say that with people of this caliber in their ranks, Labour will be in the wilderness for a long time.

    • Damon Mudgway

      Pretty hard to disclose the identify when you’re nothing more than the town mattress.

    • KGB

      It’s a good policy and they better not back down.
      Too many women having more children on benefits and refusing to name fathers.
      Poor thing doesn’t know the name of her ‘one night stand.’
      Questions to ask before sex. Name, STD status, condom???
      Poor thing.

      • XCIA

        They all have smart phones these days, they could take a picture as well.

        • KGB

          Smile … Just in case you immpregnate me 😝

        • KGB

          I can see the Facebook posts now …
          “Do you know this man?”

          • MarcWills

            That would now be “Do you know this father?”

          • curry4me

            Not so much ‘father’, as sperm donor.

      • Wheninrome

        Wouldn’t they want money up front as well, or are they totally stupid, if you are going to turn it into a job be clear on the contract, money first. I am surprised these “dads” havent been named or wanted to be named, these children can be a paycheck for them if they live with the mother and they are all on the dole, can be quite a lifestyle.

        • Korau

          How many would be brothers, fathers, uncles?

          There could be internal family pressures not to name in some cases because of the potential criminality of the sperm donation.

          • Second time around

            There are exceptions for such circumstances, but the mother still has to front up and make that claim. DNA from the child should back up incest if it is what is claimed, without fully identifying the perp. WINZ should provide a private environment for these interviews, not the open plan office Sepuloni claims is happening.

          • Huia

            It is certainly diluting the gene pool Korau.

        • lyall

          Bearing in mind how much a working father would have to pay if his offspring is identified and added to his tax bill, the ‘career solo mum’ will often be milking the ‘father’ for far more than the $20 odd she misses on the benefit!

    • kayaker

      My internal polling tells me that voters are sick of Labour going on about the downtrodden and losers.

  • Nige.

    Self driving cars is officially a thing today in Pittsburgh.

    http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN11K12Y

    • XCIA

      Uber say they are self drive, but they still have a “technician” sitting behind the wheel. Is that what we would call a Clayton’s SD car ;-)

      • jaundiced

        Reminds me of the days when you’d go to places like Farmers, and in the lift would be a man in a uniform sitting in a chair. His job was to push the floor number.

        • hookerphil

          And open the metal sliding doors

  • Wheninrome

    Children being unable to put a sentence together when starting school, this being blamed on babysitting by TV or too much screen time. Now surely making a TV part of the necessities of life or essentials of not being in poverty is backfiring.

    • Ruahine

      Obviously the answer is to tax those damn TV’s.

    • RightyTighty LeftyLoosey

      My twins started school this year. There are several NZ born Asian kids in their class whose English is extremely poor. They don’t speak it at home and my guess is that the parents let them watch TV in the hope they pick up the language. The issue I have is that they are holding back the rest of the class and sucking up all the resources to bring them up to speed.

      • Graham Pilgrim

        I suspect the boot will be on the other foot by the time they reach secondary school.

        • RightyTighty LeftyLoosey

          You’re probably right. Their culture is more focused and the parents push them harder. My point being that the parents should ensure the kids have an acceptable comprehension of the English language before they start school and thereby allowing the resources to be fairly distributed amongst the students.

          • Wheninrome

            So some of our South Auckland (to use an area) Kiwi kids might struggle to actually make it through the doors of the primary school based on the above. It is just a question of where the resources fall, kindergarten, primary school or where? Or should we stop all children from going to school until they can speak English. What about Special Needs children now they are huge users of resources – one on one etc., I believe ALL children should be given the best start in life as hopefully they will then be in a position to contribute later.

        • Martin

          Haha, “we’re Asians, not Bsians”.

      • Wheninrome

        That is an argument that the Left, and Winston might put forward against immigration. However if we follow the progress of said children through school those children of whom you speak will far outpace the others, and indeed even those who speak English as a first language. Children who have English as a first language have no excuse, apart from lack of interaction with parents and being read to at home. I have first hand knowledge of children from Asian immigrant families who do not speak English at home, the children speak perfect English having been to kindergarten here. At that age they learn language very quickly. The said thing is that their Mandarin then often has to be addressed by lessons!!
        Teachers being of a “leftish” persuasion – this would fit their agenda completely.

      • Nessie

        There are a number of Chinese language channels on Freeview. The kids probably watch them. The parents are probably working like galley slaves to make a decent life in their new country.
        Perhaps the twins’ school could investigate this, and encourage local parents to help out?

        • RightyTighty LeftyLoosey

          Well forgive me for not expecting the local parents to help out when the “galley slave” children are being dropped off in the latest Mercedes, BMW, Audis, Maserati’s and Porsche’s.

        • hookerphil

          I am not into making excuses

    • metalnwood

      I know at least one person, their speech is fine, they are fine with no problems but I thought it must be a real embarrassment to the family that she has an american accent which I know came from a tv babysitter.

      • Annoyed

        My wife has a friend who’s child has an English accent. Ironically it’s for the opposite reason. Leap Pad learning products etc have English accents so he picked the accent up while learning. Still really funny though.

    • kayaker

      A friend who has just started teaching this year says at least half of his sixth form class doesn’t know how to capitalise a sentence.

      • Wheninrome

        By the sixth form, look at either the teaching prior to the child reaching the 6th form- fail, or is the child actually attending school, in which case the parents – fail.

      • Huia

        Don’t sweat it, at least they are taking part and they will get a certificate to show that and nobody has actually blamed John Key personally yet.
        Its okay to blame the tv but the parents control the tv.
        The blame needs to be put fair and squarely at the feet of the parents, there is no input into these children from the parents apart from the very basics, (which are also missing in some cases).
        There are no books being read to the children by parents, no counting games, no educational games being played, these poor little sods miss out all around.
        This is what happens with socialism and a reliance on the Government for every aspect of your life.

        • Nessie

          Huia, 45 years ago when my kids were at primary school, their ‘new entrant’ teacher had the same complaints. She would sit them on the mat to play with books i.e. not tear them, turn pages etc, sit still and listen, answer when spoken to etc. She said it took 6 weeks to get them ready to join the class. She kept most kids in the new entrant class for a term, and then they would move on to formal schooling.
          The problem is not new, but I don’t think they have new entrant teachers any more –

          • Huia

            The first part was tongue in cheek in case you missed that.
            I agree wholeheartedly with you, children having to be taught the absolute basics when starting school is not right.
            I find it criminal negligence on behalf of the parents when a child is completely unfamiliar with books, they are not feeding that natural hunger to learn.
            The Jesuits had a saying which I have found to be quite true.
            “Give us a child until he is 7 and he is ours for life”.
            They were talking about the teaching and training of the child, not the abusive horror that have been uncovered in the churches.
            That basic training has to start at home, whether its manners, respect for others or learning to eat with your mouth closed. It is all learning, but, its falling down in some homes when immature young women are having babies before they have grown up properly themselves.

          • Miss McGerkinshaw

            Well said and only wish I could up-vote this comment hundreds of times.

            To add to your “It is all learning, but, its falling down in some homes when immature young women are having babies before they have grown up properly themselves.
            There is also the fact that they, these ‘child mothers’, have not been bought up with these essentials so have nothing to pass on.

          • Usaywot

            The Jesuits saying was “Give me a child until he is 7 and I’ll show you the man” Quite a different connotation.

          • Huia

            Aristotle is largely credited for the “Give me a child until he is 7 and I’ll show you the man”.
            The Jesuits are usually credited for the “Give me a child until he is 7 and he will be ours for life”.
            There is disagreement and discussion about which one is credited to whom, so I guess as they are both long gone from this world we will never know for sure and the debate will go on.
            Both quotes hold the truth so it really matters not a great deal who gets credited with saying them several hundred years ago, they are both good quotes.
            But, you knew what I mean and the connotation I meant as I made it fairly clear.

          • Aucky

            Yes they do have new entrant teachers and generally new entrant classes are quite small given that they gradually fill over the course of a year as children attain the age of five.

            Children’s readiness for school seems to bear little relationship to the decile of the community. Decile 10 homes have the potential to be as big a cultural and literary desert as any.

      • oldmanNZ

        I can’t be bothered either, usually the software does it for me now.

        You just type, and it magically happens.

        See, the above i didn’t use caps.

      • MarcWills

        Blame social media and phone texting for this – apparently making sense is optional in many cases.

        • Usaywot

          And lazy teachers many of whom have terrible grammar themselves.

    • Sagacious Blonde

      A relative, says immigrant new entrants, with minimal English are the least of her teaching problems these days, (they once had 17 different languages in their junior school). It is the “P” damaged kids that are the new challenge. They are turning up in alarming numbers and sucking up huge resources. Even foetal alcohol kids look good in comparison.

  • iera

    Greenpeace has “uplifted” the site office of the proposed Ruataniwha Dam and delivered it to the Hawke’s Bay Regional Council offices in Napier.

    Early this morning {Sept 13], a Greenpeace team removed the site office at Tikokino using a hiab truck, depositing it outside the front doors of the HBRC building, 100 kilometres away in Napier …

    “After what’s happened in Havelock North, the council needs to put people’s health before more industrial dairying and drop the Ruataniwha Dam,” Greenpeace Agriculture Campaigner Genevieve Toop said from Napier …
    “They need to stop using public money to prop up industrial dairying and instead support ecological farming that looks after our land, people and water.”

    Perhaps one of Greenpeace’s better “moves” recently?

    • metalnwood

      Greenpeace are greenpeace, I hope they get charged with theft and have to pay all costs involved with returning it.

    • Second time around

      They should wait till the enquiry has issued its findings. Even low intensity farming can pollute aquifers if you draw the water from directly under the bull’s bum.

  • Cadwallader

    I have suspected Vic Crone is little more than a lightweight dreamer as a mayoral candidate. Having said that; I am uncomfortable that her equivocal response to a silly question about climate change has fired-up the msm. She was being vilified by the bimbos at Paul Henry at 6am and now Stuff has jumped in. Let’s get this firmly established: Unless you loudly and resolutely declare complete allegiance to the man-made climate change dogma you are a foolish and lesser person according to the glib and corrosive msm. Free speech in the West? Balanced research and conclusions? I don’t think so. The msm seems to become less enquiring and partisan every day.

  • edenman

    From A Newspapers online pages.
    ‘”Speaker: MPs’ email woes ‘complex’
    Speaker Lockwood Smith says MPs must be able to email without interference, but getting a balance between that and cyber security could be difficult.”
    Lockwood has long gone.

    • R&BAvenger

      Journalists “trained and skilled” don’t you know?

  • XCIA

    We were discussing Meng Fong and the complaints laid against him yesterday. Here is the police response:
    “Investigation into Gisborne mayoral candidate finds no offence committed”

    Gisborne Police have concluded their investigation into a complaint made against Gisborne Mayoral candidate Mr Meng Foon, with no offence being substantiated.

    “Police spoke to numerous people identified as witnesses by the complainant in this matter,” says Detective Sergeant Kevin Ford.

    “There is absolutely no evidence – or in fact any suggestion from anyone other than the complainant – that Mr Foon has in any way been trying to corruptly influence voters.”

    “There are also no legal issues with the circumstances surrounding $20 given to a person that Mr Foon has had an association with since childhood. Koha in correct legal circumstances and in accordance with Maori custom does not translate into an offence under the Electoral Act,” says Detective Sergeant Ford.

    “It is disappointing that the complainant in this matter has continued to make allegations – and post inaccurate and inflammatory comments – on social media.
    Many of those spoken to as part of the Police investigation have expressed their anger at the allegations being made, and this matter is perhaps a useful reminder for people to be mindful of the information they post online, both in terms of accuracy and legality, and with regard to any subsequent comments others might make in response.”

    • Huia

      Time wasting and picky.
      Speaking of time and resource wasting, what is happening on the dot crim front, he appears to have gone to ground.

    • oldmanNZ

      $20? To a child hood frend.

      Wonder if defamation is on order

  • Annoyed

    Yeah, I expect this is the main reason for the Government’s policy. It also means the father doesn’t have to pay child support (obviously).

  • Seriously?

    Interesting article in the Horrid about the Delegat assault sentencing. It centers on comments for the NZ Law Society and includes the following observation (which runs opposed to the media shills accounts of “reality”) from the NZLS:

    “If any 19-year-old with no previous convictions had appeared on the same charges it is almost certain that under New Zealand’s sentencing practices they would not have received a prison sentence…. The Law Society believes we are fortunate to have a judiciary which applies the laws we have made in an impartial manner.”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11710279

    I have no reason to doubt their accuracy in that regard.

    Instead of bagging the judge, maybe the politicians ought to look at changing the law. The judge is an easy target though, they don’t / cannot fight back.

  • Eiselmann

    Love it….the Larper asked her question in Te Reo , mangling it as usual…Hekia rattled off her reply in Te Reo with ease ….then the Material Girl had difficulty understand if her question had been answered…

  • Darren Allis

    HELP – Tricky situation.

    If a local body candidate (on behalf of him/herself or both candidates), gave wrapped presents to two community board chairs during her speaking time, in front of 50-60 people at a meet the candidates meeting, is it considered “Treating”?

    I mean it’s not like he/she needed an audience for that did she?

    ALSO – The following comment was made in a post on social media does this constitute “Interfering with or influencing voters” under the Local Electoral Act? Probably not eh?

    The new voting structure means you vote for one City Councilor [Redacted] and up to two Community Board members (if you really want me to get in I suggest you simply tick just [Redacted] and leave your other vote blank)

    • Nige.

      I suggest you email your question to the tipline in the contacts tab.

      • Darren Allis

        done

  • zanyzane

    “All the banks have essentially stopped development funding at least for anything of size say >$3m. Standalone house construction finance and residential mortgages no changes but there has been a significant pull back to almost nil from the banks including Kiwibank and ASB.
    We don’t expect this to change until March 2017 and the banks which were strong in development finance namely BNZ and ANZ will be quite selective and conservative. They are less worried about the market more how much they have in property which is governed by APRA (Australian Prudential Regulating Authority).”

    Latest news for development finance in NZ from a Specialist Development Finance Broker in Auckland.

  • oldmanNZ

    Is this a scam dressed as lamb?

    Say you have kids on prepay.
    On 20$ monthly plan, get 1gb data, unlimited txt ect.

    When they plan expire at end of month, you need to top up, being kids they forget to tell oldmam.
    So it goes into iou.

    But the text, calls are all in premium cost, 20cent txt, 50c mb data ect.

    So that runs out quick then the old man top up, but can only do in 20, 30 40 $ ect.

    So they lft with $5 after iou is taking out and monthly plan paid.

    So next month, the plan runs out and then remain $5 get used at premium rates… Then iou. And the whole cycle starts again.

    So… Dont use iou kids.

    • hookerphil

      Get kids to pay for their own, will start to remember when to top up etc.

  • OneTrack

    Part of a comment to a post on an overseas web site:

    “However, be aware that ALL New Zealand lamb is almost certainly halal. Stick to the meats they sell labeled ‘English’ or ‘Dorset’ and you’ll be OK”

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