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big game hunting
In 24 (the neo-con Fox propaganda drama series for bloodthirsty Republicans) the torture is always so necessary and only the courageous and righteous do it for the sake of Amerika (cue the National anthem now), and while our own apologists in NZ who were so in favour of the Iraq war get quieter and quieter we now find out that two of the men America captured weren’t waterboarded once or twice to gain important info, America tortured them repeatedly, 83 times in one month alone, how the hell torturing someone repeatedly for information that is questionable and utterly immoral will win the war on terror is anyone’s guess,
Item 1: that 83 figure is misleading. Careful restrictions were placed on this technique and there is every reason to believe they were in fact followed.
The guidance for the employment of waterboarding restricts its use to one 30-day period, in which it can be applied on no more than five individual days. No more than two sessions are allowed in a 24-hour period, and each session may last at most two hours. Within a session, there may be at most six applications of water lasting 10 seconds or longer. No water application may last longer than 40 seconds. The total water application time may be no more than 12 minutes in a 24-hour period.
Not pretty nonetheless.
Item 2: it was necessary, and did work in at least one instance.
Fast forward to today’s piece in the Washington Post by Marc Thiessen, extensively quoting from memos recently released by the Obama administration:
The memo continues: “Before the CIA used enhanced techniques . . . KSM resisted giving any answers to questions about future attacks, simply noting, ‘Soon you will find out.’ ” Once the techniques were applied, “interrogations have led to specific, actionable intelligence, as well as a general increase in the amount of intelligence regarding al Qaeda and its affiliates.”
Specifically, interrogation with enhanced techniques “led to the discovery of a KSM plot, the ‘Second Wave,’ ‘to use East Asian operatives to crash a hijacked airliner into’ a building in Los Angeles.” KSM later acknowledged before a military commission at Guantanamo Bay that the target was the Library Tower, the tallest building on the West Coast.
Thiessen goes on to explain that the foiling of the Library Tower plot is the tip of the intelligence iceberg. We gained a lot of valuable information from waterboarding KSM, and Thiessen explains why this is so.
Sadly, a foiled plot just doesn’t stick in the mind like a successful one does.
Finally, what’s with the “while our own apologists in NZ who were so in favour of the Iraq war get quieter and quieter” quote?
Clearly Bomber has missed the news that the Iraq war is now all but won. In fact, its the detractors of the war who are being so quiet, having predicted so confidently the failure of the US they’re now looking very, very stupid not to mention cowardly. Thanks to Bush sticking to his guns for a few more months, Iraq has steeped back from the brink of civil war, which had potential to massacre thousands of civilians.
Not that the left ever seemed concerned about that possibility.
Sorry, just remembered what I was going to mention! And this has really got my blood boiling.
How can Bomber possibly suggest that it’s not ok to waterboard terrorists (who can legally be executed on the battlefield) while his fellow blogger is doing his best to promote a new holocaust by suggesting that we shouldn’t be opposing Madman Ahmadinejad.
Problem is though, what he said, it’s all [Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's claims that is - S1] true isn’t it? The Jewish State is set up for Jews – quite specifically to benefit them as a race and a religion
Hm, yes. Something about different groups trying to wipe them out… something about seven armies trying to do the same to the new state… Oh, and the fact that Arabs in Israel have better rights and conditions than any other Arab people in the middle east?
How many Arab/Muslim countries are there again? There’s only one small one surrounded by hostile Jewish ones, right? Oh wait…
- and they carry out massacres in refugee camps (like they did earlier this year)
That would be the one where they phoned all the non-combatants to get them out of the road? The one where they finally responded to months of deadly attacks aimed at their kindergartens during playtime? The one that showed once again that the biggest “massacres” Israel is supposed to commit are in fact in every case blatant hoaxes?
in order to carry out the colonial/land confiscation/occupation/subjugation template upon which Zionism has been practiced. That’s all true isn’t it – no matter how you cut it.
So long as you have a strong believe in the “evilness of the Jew” – the same attitude behind the original holocaust.
Isn’t that a scary thought? The same attitude behind Hittler’s “final solution” (with the same agenda) being accepted with open arms by our fellow countrymen. It’s not like the desired goals are being hidden either.
How any thinking person can say such things is beyond me. Holocaust denial is one thing, but Tim is well down the road of Holocaust promotion.
So he said it at the right place but he said it at the wrong time – Israel’s Holocaust Remembrance Day gave the extra pressure on Poland and Germany to cave. NZ was not there to even listen.
Ahmadinejad is pure evil. This guy breathes anti-semitism. He has openly and explicitly stated that he wants to wipe out the Jewish state.
I guess so long as he skips the waterboarding and just vaporises them it’ll be ok.
That’s it, I wash my hands of their particular kind of evil.