Listen to the people who may have been involved in shooting down MH17 looking for anything that can justify the mistake in military terms…
A Malaysian Airlines passenger plane has been shot down on the Russian-Ukraine border, killing all 295 people on board, according to a Ukrainian interior ministry official.
Flight MH17, which was carrying 280 passengers and 15 crew, was flying between Amsterdam and Kuala Lumpur after taking off at lunchtime today.
Read our earlier live reports here. It contains a lot of background information, some of it superseded, but most of it still useful.
LIVE UPDATING CLOSED. Any further major updates will happen via their own posts, minor updates via Daily Roundup and or the general debate posts.
Phone call transcript via Kyiv Post
Igor Bezler: We have just shot down a plane. Group Minera. It fell down beyond Yenakievo (Donetsk Oblast).
Vasili Geranin: Pilots. Where are the pilots?
IB: Gone to search for and photograph the plane. It’s smoking.
VG: How many minutes ago?
IB: About 30 minutes ago.
Second call (approx 40 minutes later) Read more »
UPDATED (LIVE REPORTING CONTINUES HERE)
An Air New Zealand spokeswoman says the airline does not operate any routes that fly over Ukraine, nor does it have a passenger sharing arrangement with airlines that do.
More of a “no news’ update: MFaT still unable to comment on New Zealand passenger numbers on MH17.
Schiphol reports: 154 Dutch; 27 Australian; 23 Malaysia; 11 Indonesia; 6 UK; 4 Germany; 4 Belgium; 3 Philippines; 1 Canada; 47 unknown. All 15 crew members were Malaysian.
Press conference in The Netherlands from Shiphol.
Press conference audio
Passengers are from Netherlands with 143 passengers. Australia comes in second with 27 passengers. There were 11 Indonesian passengers and one infant on-board the ill-fated flight. Britain has six passengers, France and Germany have four each, Belgium have three and Canada one. Nationalities of the other 58 passengers were not stated in the list.
UNCONFIRMED – Nationalities Passenger details Netherlands 143 Australian 27 Malaysian 20 (including 2 infants) Indonesian 11 (including 1 infant) Read more »
No wonder various countries periodically conduct their wars on the soil of these two countries.
A group of Belgians have started a campaign to introduce a “beer pass” to stop Dutch tourists buying beer in Belgium. The ironic protest comes in response to the introduction pass system to stop ‘drugs tourists’ from buying cannabis in Dutch border provinces.
TED Talk by Peter van Uhm who is the Netherlands’ chief of defense, but that does not mean he is pro-war.
At TEDxAmsterdam he explains how his career is one shaped by a love of peace, not a desire for bloodshed — and why we need armies if we want peace.
“That is why I took up the gun — not to shoot, not to kill, not to destroy, but to stop those who would do evil, to protect the vulnerable, to defend democratic values, to stand up for the freedom we have to talk … about how we can make the world a better place.”
No not for skiing in off-piste avalanche areas but for this:
The crucial moment in his life as a member of the Dutch nobility came with his 2003 engagement to then-commoner Wisse Smit.
After the pair announced their intention to marry in 2003, Dutch media revealed that Wisse Smit’s previous friendships included contacts while she was in college with a well-known figure in the Dutch underworld, a drug dealer who was later slain.
The couple publicly acknowledged having been “naive and incomplete” during her vetting process before joining the royal family. Then-Prime Minister Jan Peter Balkenende signaled he could not recommend the marriage to parliament for approval.
They married anyway, a decision that meant Friso’s removal from the line of succession.
The couple are still part of Beatrix’s family and attend important royal functions. Mabel has been granted the title “Princess Mabel” and Friso has an array of noble titles, including “Prince of Oranje-Nassau” but not “Prince of the Netherlands.”
Apparently in Holland you need the permission of the government to marry a commoner if you are royalty and remain in the succession.