PPTA Beyond Hypocrisy

On January 11 Angela Roberts the new PPTA commander criticised John Banks for encouraging the public to make submissions on the Education Amendment Bill (2012).

She was especially critical as teachers are “busy” and she thinks all of New Zealand is on holiday at this time.

The PPTA response is to avoid its members doing any thinking and to set up a tick box – comments already filled in submission form for its members to click on and send to the select committee. Amazing hypocrisy given Roberts’ comments on Banks.

The PPTA clearly thinks members haven’t the brains to think through things for themselves and have to be told what to think.

Can any secondary teacher be happy to be represented like this. They must simply be embarrassed. No good teacher simply asks students to parrot their words.

Some highlights are:

  • I/we oppose the intent of this bill because it creates the framework for the approval and establishment of charter schools  which pose a threat to New Zealand’s world-leading quality public education system.
  •  Charter schools undermine quality teaching.
  •  Charter schools undermine quality schools.
  •  Charter schools undermine quality learning for kids.
  • The New Zealand Curriculum is a world-leading curriculum that focuses on key competencies learners require to make an effective and productive contribution as citizens in the 21st century.
  • Charter schools can be run by private companies and make a profit by creaming off the most successful students and leaving local state schools to support the children with the most complex and challenging needs.
  • The PPTA in their desperation to protect their patch are encouraging their members to make submissions that contain a whole range of unsupported/unsubstantiated statements. This being their position despite Timms reports showing NZ’s education system standing internationally on the slide and the fact there is a massive tail of underachievement.

The PPTA submission form must be an opportunity for the Whale Army to alter some text and make substantial submissions. This will be a surprise to Angela Roberts because on her planet everyone is on holiday. Good choice of commander PPTA members.

 


THANK YOU for being a subscriber. Because of you Whaleoil is going from strength to strength. It is a little known fact that Whaleoil subscribers are better in bed, good looking and highly intelligent. Sometimes all at once! Please Click Here Now to subscribe to an ad-free Whaleoil.

  • stinkeye2

    Whale, I submitted this to the useless pricks:

  • LesleyNZ

    “on holiday” being the operative words. Yes most of the public are not on holiday like the secondary teachers are.

  • Orange

    Well it makes me embarrassed and I didn’t think she could be worse than Duffy Government Slayer. At least I didn’t vote for her.

  • DangerMice

    It amuses me that on one hand we have the PPTA saying unqualified teachers will make the children explode or something, but on the other we have Unitec proudly showing off the industry/corporate leader guest lecturers they have on the back of every 2nd bus I see.

    • Hazards001

      The PPTA is not concerned about unqualified teachers. This is NZ. You can’t get a job digging a ditch in this country anymore unless you are qualified! What has their tits in a tangle is not being Registered which is pretty much the same as saying not in the union.

      • DangerMice

        Yep my mistake, I did mean registered.

      • Malcolm Clarke

        The NZ Teachers Council and PPTA are two different organisations, are they not? Let me help you out a bit:

        http://www.teacherscouncil.govt.nz/

        http://www.ppta.org.nz/

        • Hazards001

          Right. So no problems then huh?
          Question 1: A person that has a qualification (any qualification) and is offered a teaching position by a prospective employer at a Charter School and is not a registered member of the teachers council or the PPTA can go teach at that charter school..yes or no?
          Question 2:Now as it stands can that same person go teach in any other school?
          I’ll leave it to you to let me know. And lame arsed links to websites mean nothing. Why the f… would I bother wasting my time on homepages?

          • Malcolm Clarke

            Because you needed to know the info. I can’t begin to imagine what info you needed before. Now I’ve started you off, you can research the rest. I have other things to do… No need to swear at me either. I’m only trying to point you in the right direction!! Have a good evening!

          • Hazards001

            I don’t need pointed in the right direction. My contempt for teachers is well known amongst my peers and legendary. So…back to the start..the reason school teachers are against charter schools is because the government will not require teachers to be registered. And to be a registered teacher as I understand it you have to be a member of the union..yes or no?
            And don’t condescend to me you sanctimonious cunt..I’ve fucked teachers over since I was a fucking 12 year old.

          • Malcolm Clarke

            No you don’t need to be part of the union. I’m not. So, from one sanctimonious person to another, what was the original issue you had?

          • Mr Whatever

            This is dedicated to you as I think it sums you up perfectly… http://youtu.be/uP_3goBZj1Y

          • A_Teacher

            Your character stands revealed by your own words.

          • Hazards001

            As anyone who has ever met me would agree.

          • A_Teacher

            Because they contain information completely relevant to the points you raise. The PPTA and the Teacher’s Council ARE different organisations.

  • timandtim

    isn’t amazing that Cambridge University in the UK was founded by people who had no formal qualifications and set up for the nobles and yet we do Cambridge exams here

    • Malcolm Clarke

      Just to be clear, Cambridge International Exams was set up to provide an examination system to countries that do not have a robust exam system. NZQA does have one or two faults but, in the whole, it is a great system that caters for students of all levels. You don’t need to take my word for it. Please do your own research and see for yourself.

      • stinkeye2

        Yep, you can get your level 2 without getting level 1, and also get your level 2 and 3 with quad bike courses, chainsawing and defensive driving!

        So you can leave school with 0 English and Math credits and still look good!

        Real great system

      • Hazards001

        NZQA is a crock of shit. A system set up to ensure girls do better at school by catering to the way girls work and put in place by the lesbos and feminazis. A year long project with fluffy colouring in and pretty pics gets you a pass. I’m sorry but the real world is the here and now! Bring back exam based curriculum or see a world dominated by the Helen Clarks and Jenny Shipleys of this world. Fucking school teachers! God help us!

        • Malcolm Clarke

          What shall we do about it? Rant and rave and swear at somebody who has no power to change the ‘crock of shit?’ I’m at a loss as what to do about it… Perhaps Whale Oil can change things…??

          • I’d start by sacking more than a few useless teachers and especially ones with a surname that starts with C

          • Malcolm Clarke

            Lets go one step better and get rid of all current teachers. They must be useless… That’ll solve the problem aye?

        • A_Teacher

          School Teachers are not to blame for the NCEA…there was substantial resistance within the teaching profession to its introduction. We didn’t create it, we just have to work with it.

          • Hazards001

            Where on earth did I say I thought teachers created this appalling cock up? I’ve said plenty of times that the dykes and feminazis of the Liabour party that you support is responsible for it though.

          • A_Teacher

            Where do you get the idea that I support the Labour Party from?

          • Hazards001

            you’re right…my mistake. Upon review it is clear you are actually a little slimeball and a green party supporter.

          • A_Teacher

            I am ex-Combat Engineer, 194cm, 103kg and a past heavy weight kickboxer. I am most definitely *not* a Green Party supporter and you stand revealed as someone that is happy making up any old bullshit that supports your prejudice.

    • Malcolm Clarke

      The name Cambridge is synonymous with quality education. Cambridge University has a great reputation and thus, this is the reason many schools have started to use the exams. This does not equate to NZQA being no good. Perhaps we should concentrate on improvements on what is already there and not trying to ‘reinvent the wheel’…?

    • rangitoto

      I thought Cambridge Uni was founded by refugees from the famous Oxford Town vs Gown riots over watered down ale.

  • Anna Kirtlan

    Just to clarify – the submission form was aimed at members of the public who may not have been alerted to the submission deadline. PPTA has certainly been encouraging members to write their own submissions (which is evident if you click on the ‘read more;
    button below the advertisement on the website http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/-issues-in-education/charter-schools/2487-sub-edu-amdt-bill-2012) and has received many considered and well-written ones. The real concern here is the inclusion of provisions for groups of people to use taxpayer money without being open to public scrutiny. Given this blog is normally one of the first to point out corrupt practices the silence on this issue is somewhat surprising.

    • stinkeye2

      They are still under scrutiny – the government has announced it will make corporates tax information public information public, changing old IRD law.

      As all transactions include GST or PAYE etc it will then be transparent as to what they are spending on.

      • AnnaKirtlan

        What the education amendment bill appears to do though is give a legislative exclusion to this – but I guess only time will tell

        • stinkeye2

          It will exclude it from the OIA but because the government is making these charter schools corporations they will have financial information publicly available soon, by law.

    • owl

      Anna welcome – as you are the Communications Manager for the PPTA it is great to see you comment on here. Yes submissions are fine the whole debate stems around as you say accountability. Many organisations use the same format that you have set up for your members. I know the Flavell gambling submission used a similar format by sporting clubs.

      No one is being silent – can you answer one simple question for me.

      What is wrong with have a charter school if parents are allowed to choose them if they want to send their children there?. Nowhere have I read that they wont be audited.

      The PPTA has many commercial operations running in their balance sheet so what really is the difference?

      And I sincerely look forward to your response

      • AnnaKirtlan

        The above reply was meant to go to you but I kept getting booted because of my spammy account. Apologies!

      • AnnaKirtlan

        Hi Owl, thanks for the welcome. It’s very easy to let
        getting into online debates distract you from your work which is why I usually avoid commenting on blogs – but I felt this one did need a bit of clarification given our members are working hard to create their own submissions.

        To answer your question, overseas experience shows that with
        charter schools it’s not the parents that get the choice, it’s the schools that do the choosing and it’s not that kids that need that most support that they are going to choose. In many places in America parents have lost the right to send their children to their local school entirely. There has also been a serious loss of parent voice in these schools and communities, with parent representation (ie boards of trustees) actively discouraged. It’s not choice if parents lose their right to have a voice. A good example of how charter schools affect parents can be seen here in a presentation by New Orleans parent Karran Harper Royal. She advocates for parents who have lost their voice through the charter school process and includes video interviews with them here: http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/annual-conference/2424-karran-harper-royal

        The other issue with ‘choice’ is that, as Treasury points out, it might work for some individuals, but it’s not going to provide a system-wide lift. It is easy to set up schools so some students succeed – the challenge is how to do it so all kids succeed. To really make a difference for everyone, choice within schools (ie range of subjects, different types of pathways and approaches) is much more effective that choice between schools,
        which can lead to bad economies of scale, wide disparities and polarised
        demographics. The countries that have successful outcomes in this respect, like Finland, follow totally different policies.

        In terms of charter schools in New Zealand not being audited, if you read the proposed legislation, it clearly shows that charter schools will not be subject to the Official Information Act or the scrutiny of the Office of the Auditor General.

        In regard to commercial operations on our balance sheet – I’m
        afraid I’m not entirely sure what you are talking about there!

      • AnnaKirtlan

        Hi Owl, thanks for the welcome. It’s very easy to let
        getting into online debates distract you from your work which is why I usually
        avoid commenting on blogs – but I felt this one did need a bit of clarification
        given our members are working hard to create their own submissions.

        To answer your question, overseas experience shows that with
        charter schools it’s not the parents that get the choice, it’s the schools that
        do the choosing and it’s not that kids that need that most support that they
        are going to choose. In many places in America parents have lost the right to
        send their children to their local school entirely. There has also been a
        serious loss of parent voice in these schools and communities, with parent
        representation (ie boards of trustees) actively discouraged. It’s not choice if
        parents lose their right to have a voice. A good example of how charter schools
        affect parents can be seen here in a presentation by New Orleans parent Karran
        Harper Royal. She advocates for parents who have lost their voice through the
        charter school process and includes video interviews with them here: http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/annual-conference/2424-karran-harper-royal

        The other issue with ‘choice’ is that, as Treasury points
        out, it might work for some individuals, but it’s not going to provide a
        system-wide lift. It is easy to set up schools so some students succeed – the
        challenge is how to do it so all kids succeed. To really make a difference for
        everyone, choice within schools (ie range of subjects, different types of
        pathways and approaches) is much more effective that choice between schools,
        which can lead to bad economies of scale, wide disparities and polarised
        demographics. The countries that have successful outcomes in this respect, like
        Finland, follow totally different policies.

        In terms of charter schools in New Zealand not being
        audited, if you read the proposed legislation, it clearly shows that charter
        schools will not be subject to the Official Information Act or the scrutiny of
        the Office of the Auditor General.

        In regard to commercial operations on our balance sheet – I’m
        afraid I’m not entirely sure what you are talking about there!

      • AnnaKirtlan

        Hi Owl, I have tried to answer your questions a number of times now but for some reason the response keeps getting deleted. Is there a word length on responses here?

        • owl

          I dont know – but very interested in reading your response – maybe you can send it to WO and he can post on line

          • AnnaKirtlan

            I’ll have another crack at posting it myself and if that doesn’t work I’ll try your idea – thanks!

          • AnnaKirtlan

            Hi Owl, thanks for the welcome. It’s very easy to let
            getting into online debates distract you from your work which is why I usually avoid commenting on blogs – but I felt this one did need a bit of clarification given our members are working hard to create their own submissions.
            To answer your question, overseas experience shows that with
            charter schools it’s not the parents that get the choice, it’s the schools that do the choosing and it’s not that kids that need the most support that they are going to choose. In many places in America parents have lost the right to send their children to their local school entirely. There has also been a serious loss of parent voice in these schools and communities, with parent
            representation (ie boards of trustees) actively discouraged. It’s not choice if parents lose their right to have a voice. A good example of how charter schools affect parents can be seen here in a presentation by New Orleans parent Karran Harper Royal. She advocates for parents who have lost their voice through the
            charter school process and includes video interviews with them here: http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/annual-conference/2424-karran-harper-royal
            The other issue with ‘choice’ is that, as Treasury points
            out, it might work for some individuals, but it’s not going to provide a
            system-wide lift. It is easy to set up schools so some students succeed – the challenge is how to do it so all kids succeed. To really make a difference for everyone, choice within schools (ie range of subjects, different types of pathways and approaches) is much more effective that choice between schools,
            which can lead to bad economies of scale, wide disparities and polarised demographics. The countries that have successful outcomes in this respect, like Finland, follow totally different policies.

            In terms of charter schools in New Zealand not being
            audited, if you read the proposed legislation, it clearly shows that charter schools will not be subject to the Official Information Act or the scrutiny of the Office of the Auditor General.

            In regard to commercial operations on our balance sheet –
            I’m afraid I’m not entirely sure what you are talking about there!

          • AnnaKirtlan

            Hi Owl, thanks for the welcome. It’s very easy to let getting into online debates distract you from your work which is why I usually
            avoid commenting on blogs – but I felt this one did need a bit of clarification given our members are working hard to create their own submissions.
            To answer your question, overseas experience shows that with
            charter schools it’s not the parents that get the choice, it’s the schools that do the choosing and it’s not that kids that need the most support that they are going to choose. In many places in America parents have lost the right to send their children to their local school entirely. There has also been a serious loss of parent voice in these schools and communities, with parent representation (ie boards of trustees) actively discouraged. It’s not choice if parents lose their right to have a voice. A good example of how charter schools affect parents can be seen here in a presentation by New Orleans parent Karran Harper Royal. She advocates for parents who have lost their voice through the
            charter school process and includes video interviews with them here: http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/annual-conference/2424-karran-harper-royal

            The other issue with ‘choice’ is that, as Treasury points out, it might work for some individuals, but it’s not going to provide a system-wide lift. It is easy to set up schools so some students succeed – the
            challenge is how to do it so all kids succeed. To really make a difference for everyone, choice within schools (ie range of subjects, different types of pathways and approaches) is much more effective that choice between schools, which can lead to bad economies of scale, wide disparities and polarised demographics. The countries that have successful outcomes in this respect, like Finland, follow totally different policies.

            In terms of charter schools in New Zealand not being audited, if you read the proposed legislation, it clearly shows that charter schools
            will not be subject to the Official Information Act or the scrutiny of the
            Office of the Auditor General.

            In regard to commercial operations on our balance sheet –
            I’m afraid I’m not entirely sure what you are talking about there!

      • A_Teacher

        What are these ‘commercial operations’ that the PPTA has running in their balance sheet?

    • manuka416

      Anna, isn’t the PPTA opposed to forms of public scrutiny of taxpayer-funded schools? E.g. opposition to the publication of National Standards results?

      • Anna Kirtlan

        2011 upfats.com Boxing Day Sale Now

        Thinking of starting your Christmas shopping early? Clever you! I just got my Toshiba Qosmio X505-Q880 TruBrite Gaming Laptop on this website: upfats.com They can provide you all kinds of digital electronic products. you would enjoy the lowest price and the excellent quality along with the best service. From 23rd ,Nov to 28th, Dec, they have all kinds of christmas decorations as free gift for you.
        Merry christmas to you and your family in advance!

  • Bunswalla

    The objection that charter schools will cream off all the best students appears to be at odds with their position that non-qualified and unregistered teachers delivering a non-standard curriculum will undermine quality teaching, quality learning and quality schools.

    If charter schools are going to be so shite and such a big risk to our precious children, why do they assume (correctly) that all the best students will want to go there?

    • A_Teacher

      I am not expecting that the Charter Schools will cream off the best students…I’m expecting them to be used as a dumping ground for the students that the government doesn’t want to include in their educational achievement statistics…

  • Bunswalla

    Feck! I wrote out a sensible but pointed submission and the fecking server crashed and didn’t send any data. I guess the Whale Army has mobilised big-time. Although I do fear that since the submission site is just a SurveyMonkey questionnaire, they will cull responses such as mine and Stinkeye’s. At least they’ll know we’re on to them.

  • Saccharomyces

    Here’s what I submitted :

    I would like to lend my support to the bill.
    1. because it creates the framework for the approval and establishment of charter schools (partnership schools/kura hourua) which are a great addition to New Zealand education system.
    2. I SUPPORT clauses 23,24, 25 and 26 of the Bill which make changes to sections 120A – 120C (teacher registration) of the Education Act (“the Act”) and section 158T which will:
    – allow charters schools to hire unqualified people to work as teachers
    – permit principals to be non-teachers
    – exempts charter schools from the Act’s Teachers Council provisions.
    3. I SUPPORT Clause 31 in its entirety.
    4. I SUPPORT Section 158 D which does not oblige charter schools to follow the New Zealand Curriculum. As I feel that for some cases the one-size-fits-all of the NZ curriculum is not appropriate.
    In short, I think this is potentially one of the best reforms in eduction that NZ could see in recent years.

    You can just fill it in here http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/SC/MakeSub/f/b/4/50SCES_SCF_00DBHOH_BILL11822_1-Education-Amendment-Bill.htm, you don’t need to use the PPTA one.

    • Lofty

      Cheers Sacc, I used some of your submission in my own.

      Far better to use the parliamentary submission rather than the PPTA where one would most likely to discover its final resting place as the round file.
      Or perhaps do both.

  • AnnaKirtlan

    Hi Owl, thanks for the welcome. It’s very easy to let
    getting into online debates distract you from your work which is why I usually
    avoid commenting on blogs – but I felt this one did need a bit of clarification
    given our members are working hard to create their own submissions.

    To answer your question, overseas experience shows that with
    charter schools it’s not the parents that get the choice, it’s the schools that
    do the choosing and it’s not that kids that need that most support that they
    are going to choose. In many places in America parents have lost the right to send their children to their local school entirely. There has also been a
    serious loss of parent voice in these schools and communities, with parent
    representation (ie boards of trustees) actively discouraged. It’s not choice if
    parents lose their right to have a voice. A good example of how charter schools affect parents can be seen here in a presentation by New Orleans parent Karran Harper Royal. She advocates for parents who have lost their voice through the charter school process and includes video interviews with them here: http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/annual-conference/2424-karran-harper-royal

    The other issue with ‘choice’ is that, as Treasury points out, it might work for some individuals, but it’s not going to provide a system-wide lift. It is easy to set up schools so some students succeed – the challenge is how to do it so all kids succeed. To really make a difference for everyone, choice within schools (ie range of subjects, different types of pathways and approaches) is much more effective that choice between schools, which can lead to bad economies of scale, wide disparities and polarised demographics. The countries that have successful outcomes in this respect, like Finland, follow totally different policies.

    In terms of charter schools in New Zealand not being audited, if you read the proposed legislation, it clearly shows that charter schools will not be subject to the Official Information Act or the scrutiny of the Office of the Auditor General.

    In regard to commercial operations on our balance sheet – I’m afraid I’m not entirely sure what you are talking about there!

  • AnnaKirtlan

    Apologies for spam earlier. SIgned in with my Yahoo account and it looks like thing’s been hacked!

    • AnonWgtn

      Yea – blame the system !!!

  • AnnaKirtlan

    Hi Owl, thanks for the welcome. It’s very easy to let getting into online debates distract you from your work which is why I usually
    avoid commenting on blogs – but I felt this one did need a bit of clarification given our members are working hard to create their own submissions.
    To answer your question, overseas experience shows that with
    charter schools it’s not the parents that get the choice, it’s the schools that do the choosing and it’s not that kids that need the most support that they are going to choose. In many places in America parents have lost the right to send their children to their local school entirely. There has also been a serious loss of parent voice in these schools and communities, with parent representation (ie boards of trustees) actively discouraged. It’s not choice if parents lose their right to have a voice. A good example of how charter schools affect parents can be seen here in a presentation by New Orleans parent Karran Harper Royal. She advocates for parents who have lost their voice through the
    charter school process and includes video interviews with them here: http://www.ppta.org.nz/index.php/annual-conference/2424-karran-harper-royal

    The other issue with ‘choice’ is that, as Treasury points out, it might work for some individuals, but it’s not going to provide a system-wide lift. It is easy to set up schools so some students succeed – the
    challenge is how to do it so all kids succeed. To really make a difference for everyone, choice within schools (ie range of subjects, different types of pathways and approaches) is much more effective that choice between schools, which can lead to bad economies of scale, wide disparities and polarised demographics. The countries that have successful outcomes in this respect, like Finland, follow totally different policies.

    In terms of charter schools in New Zealand not being audited, if you read the proposed legislation, it clearly shows that charter schools
    will not be subject to the Official Information Act or the scrutiny of the
    Office of the Auditor General.

    In regard to commercial operations on our balance sheet –
    I’m afraid I’m not entirely sure what you are talking about there!

  • blokeintakapuna

    Another unionist regurgitating her “leaders” hype about Finland again… now how’d that true comparison go again?

  • AnnaKirtlan

    Sorry for this. I have signed in with another account now and WO says he will remove spam and double ups shortly

    • Anna Kirtlan

      2011 upfats.com Boxing Day Sale Now

      Thinking of starting your Christmas shopping early? Clever you! I just got my Toshiba Qosmio X505-Q880 TruBrite Gaming Laptop on this website: upfats.com They can provide you all kinds of digital electronic products. you would enjoy the lowest price and the excellent quality along with the best service. From 23rd ,Nov to 28th, Dec, they have all kinds of christmas decorations as free gift for you.
      Merry christmas to you and your family in advance!

  • DavidW

    Thats the ticket Anna, just keep on hitting the send button, it is sure to feel better when you stop.
    You have demonstrated inadvertently (I hope) one of the biggest failings in our education system and the one which many like myself consider to be ample justification for a go at Charter Schools. In spite of overwhelming evidence that the current system is failing a significant proportion of students (remember them, they are the ones who the system is meant to be all about) the PPTA is insisting on trying to convince us that change is not needed. Just keep on with the same old thing and it will all be OK in the end. As an aside you might remember the definition of futility – continuing to do the same thing while hoping for a different outcome.
    Well Anna,it is not OK and will not be OK unless something radical is done. The more resistance that is mounted to efforts at improvement, the greater will be the casualty rate when change happens.
    Anna I sincerely hope your members have thought this through unless they are being treated as useful idiots on whose behalf the elite of the PPTA bang on.

  • owl

    I am not sure which response to respond to – looks like there are a number of duplicates.

    Thanks for your response – The Owl will digest (why is there a fixation with Finland and the Left) – can I say i have been up in that part of world and had a delightful dinner with some people and we discussed in-depth the social impact in that part of the world. Highly intelligent people I was with and they said “all things aside the biggest part of living in Finland, Sweden was that it was dark for 6 months of the year and depression and suicide and mental health problems were enormous” They invest so much government taxes too make peoples lives happier – they referred it to the happy taxes – which if I remember rightly was far more than ours.

    I digress – to answer your last question – your balance sheets shows millions in investments etc not to mention the “Presidents Apartment”. Not a bad gig – own apartment.

    However thanks again for your response

    • AnnaKirtlan

      Yes, sorry about that – apparently the comments were dropping into the spam folder when I tried to post them and when WO approved them all my attempts were posted en masse.

      Re our balance sheets – there’s no conspiracy there. We prudently manage members’ money which means we own office space sufficient
      for our needs and invest money as insurance against a politically-inspired
      “emergency”- something unions need to always factor in. One day we hope one day New Zealand will become a more mature democracy where we won’t need to take such precautions, but in the meantime the fund is there to support our members.

      Because the president is on secondment from a teaching job elsewhere (our current president is from Christchurch and our new president from Taranaki) we provide modest accommodation in Wellington (and it
      is modest!).

      Hope that clarifies things a bit!

      BTW, for everything you say about Finland, it ranks as the happiest country in the world so maybe you shouldn’t be so quick to dismiss the lessons we might learn there.

      • owl

        Cheers – never claimed conspiracy theory but at the end of the day still a commercial operation. What deems a politically inspired “emergency” – now you have me very interested.

        Please explain.

        Finland – hmmm having been there and also Israel and Eygpt, Thailand, USA, Canada, Australia, UK, Ireland, Portugal, Spain, Germany, Switzerland, France and probably a few more countries – I also found them very happy people as well and people who live in Te Kuiti.

        Though Finland does have alot of snow though don’t you think.

      • manuka416

        Finland has a much higher suicide rate than NZ: http://www.who.int/mental_health/prevention/suicide_rates/en/

        Isn’t that a better measure of happiness?

      • owl

        Anna you do realize your comment about build a war chest to fight political inspired “emergency” fund which all unions factors in opens a major can of worms..was hoping for a response. These comments and I assuming you are now let the cat of the bag about unions. Building war chests against political interference and national or right leaning government is up there with Lance Armstrong confessions. Was hoping for a response so you could clarify. So past posts saying that unions have $100m war chest for political reasons and not employment reasons or membership welfare is therefore correct.
        I suggest by midday tomorrow to formally respond for clarification or one can now assume every belief the owl has had is confirmed.

        • AnnaKirtlan

          Um, wow. I’m terribly sorry to disappoint you but no cat, no bag
          and definitely no $100 million “war chest”. With all due respect
          those assumptions are pretty unhinged!

          I am not sure where you are getting your figures, but it’s certainly not our balance sheet. You claim to have read our annual accounts – but you wouldn’t have found that figure, or anything remotely close
          to that, in there.

          The emergency fund is to support members if the government (whatever political flavour) makes policies or decisions that will
          hurt them, schools, students and education in general – it has nothing to do with shoring up against a right wing government. Our members vote across the political spectrum and – contrary to what the conspiracy-theorists like to believe – we are not aligned to any
          party (Labour governments have come up with some pretty shocking education policies also) – what we fight for is education in general.

          I responded to your questions initially because I thought you genuinely wanted accurate information and posted under my own name because I do not feel the need to hide behind a cloak of anonymity. I am beginning to believe this was a mistake as I really do not have the time or inclination to waste my days batting back paranoid conspiracy theories. It is bringing home to me the reason I don’t usually comment on blogs in the first place.

          I am happy to arrange a meeting with our financial director, face-to-face so she can endeavour to sort out your multiple confusions but I won’t be wasting any more of my time.

          • AnnaKirtlan

            There will be no formal response, either before midday or
            after it. We do not respond to threats and are not phased by bizarre accusations made under the protection of anonymity

          • owl

            but you did respond – see response above re anonymity

            I never made a threat – the Owl is not like that – just gave a timetable.
            You keep to it – thank you

          • owl

            Hi – yes response was fine – no paranoia in my world. Firstly the $100M is based on combined union capital which has been blogged about before.

            Appreciate and respect you using your name (you get a big tick) – as I have blogged before I am allowed to be anonymous because I don’t get paid for any of my work therefore I am only a normal person in public who receives political messages like your ad in the newspaper. The PPTA has asked me to raise arms against charter schools.

            It is naive of paid bloggers or in your case PPTA to think that the public doesn’t have the right to respond just because we use anonymous names.

            Firstly, let say for this argument we use the PPTA who have invaded my privacy with a full page ad in the paper about charter schools. Your ad isn’t personally addressed to me yet you invade our breakfast table and my kids read it and say Dad what is this about – are we going to military school? so don’t think the public cant respond in an anonymous way.

            Secondly I have blogged about my past and the reason why I remain private with my name. I was threaten before by union people and it was incredibly ugly and incredibly unjust – and more importantly it was the same week the Unions started an anti-bully campaign in the workplace. Amazing stuff.

            But reality is this – your answers are respected and do continue to get your message across here but Unions have failed to file correct returns and have hidden millions of dollars of cash from public scrutiny – FACT – if you want the public to believe in you get your CTU members to follow the laws of the land and I will tell you right now – the public will get along side you.

            The problem I have is that you made the statement that unions factor in building a war chest of millions to halt “politically inspired emergencies”.
            If I was David Shearer i would be s**ting bricks – unions are going to mobilize against me at any stage based on your response – anyone of any political flavour to be precise – Esp now that you have 40% of the block vote.
            Oh by the way was speaking with a teacher and a PSA member the other day and they said they cant wait for the sale of the assets so they can buy shares.

            But thank you again

  • Malcolm Clarke

    The conversation on here is clearly not about solving the problem. Rather, it’s about union bashing, Labour bashing and teacher bashing!

    Well, perhaps NZ should introduce an unregulated organisation to run schools. Clearly it’s not working at the moment, if we take heed to some of the comments here… Yes, let’s deregulate, let’s not have a curriculum… That’s the solution. The world has got it wrong for over 100 years. Silly me for thinking I had worked it all out! I’m now going to slink into a dark corner…

    • stinkeye2

      Clearly is isn’t working, as we have a high rate of kids leaving without basic skills.

      Or doesn’t it matter?

      • Malcolm Clarke

        It does matter. See my thoughts written above. I have no other solutions as I’m not in a position of power to do anything about it. This debate needs to be happening in Parliament perhaps?

    • CJA

      Okay I can understand the sentiment and how people would believe it’s union bashing, Labour bashing and teacher bashing etc based on some of the comments but and here’s the big BUT how can a system be working properly if 20% (and this was the number bandied about and I can’t be sure it’s 100% correct) of the students are failing. Can we not try something different to see if it works? Granted if Charter Schools turn out to be a flop then go at them as much as you want but not before. Sure there are studies that say Charter Schools don’t work in other countries but those countries have different environments, different teachers, different teaching styles and the list could go on. I don’t see any other solutions being offered for the education systems problems (although I stand to be corrected) from the teachers union or Labour etc so don’t knock it until it’s tried.

      • Malcolm Clarke

        It is virtually impossible to have 100% achievement. This is true all over the world, including Finland.

        To have 100% success with our students would mean the classes would need to be taught in all the home languages we have in the class.

        The assessments would need to be delivered exactly the same to all students. This means if a student was deaf or blind or have a disability that meant they couldn’t physically write themselves or if they couldn’t pick up a saw or whatever else happens in whatever other subject the students take, someone or something would be needed to provide assistance in order for the student to achieve the same grades the same grades as other ‘able’ students.

        This explanation doesn’t even do this problem any favours, as I only know what I know according to the limited experiences I have seen at the six schools I have taught at both here in NZ and in the UK.

        I have no solutions as to how to solve this particular aspect of the 20% underachievement we have in our schools. Just like I have no solutions as to how NZers can catch up with Australian wages the media is obsessed about reporting.

        Clearly it isn’t working. What do we as a country do then?

    • DavidW

      Malcolm, you might also like to cogitate on the contradictions when the opponents of Charter Schools on the one hand claim that they don’t work overseas so they won’t work here while they are simultaneously claiming that NZ is unique and need to have “local solutions to local problems” All that tells me is that any opposition is agenda driven and those who claim to be faithful to our childrens’ education don’t really have a clue.

      • Malcolm Clarke

        Not sure what you are talking about… Opposition to what? Charter schools or unions?

      • Malcolm Clarke

        I’ve just read your comment again and yes, opposition to anything is agenda driven. Until i understand the context you are speaking in, all I can say at this point is the following quote:

        It doesn’t matter how flat a pancake is, it still has two sides!

  • Malcolm Clarke

    I love this random quote that happened to be on this page… Very apt?

    “Putting up your own sign – that’s free speech.Standing in front of my sign and calling us every name under the sun? That’s also free speech.Wrecking other people’s opportunity to have a say is nasty, childish, and illegal.”
    — John Pagani

    :-)

41%