Sunday General Debate

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  • My first Mother’s Day without my Mum…can’t ring her, can’t talk to her…and grass and dirt don’t talk back

    • Then again it’s a Beautiful Day:

    • Harroputza

      I’ll talk to you. We can be friends and go to the Domain together and feed the ducks and geese. Right? Guys…?

    • LesleyNZ

      No they don’t. Your mum will always be in your heart and in your mind. Memories are like treasure.

  • williamabong

    Nick Smith has had some shockers but he may just be onto a winner with this one http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/8662181/Govt-plans-to-ditch-Housing-NZ-properties
    Time some of the bleeding heart liberal softcocks got some first hand experience of some of the shit living in state funded accommodation.
    The ultimate would be to cut these groups of from the public purse altogether, that way they could find out how easy and cheap we have made it for the welfare generation.

    • johnbronkhorst

      Wasn’t this part of a plan National mooted a couple of years ago?

      • williamabong

        Huge plus allow some of these people to carry some of the social responsibility that comes with actually having to look after themselves, yeah right

  • i think that with all the drama going on about “legal highs” the government ought to capitalize on this by IMPLYING that they are considering a move to legalise the real thing. this would be going against my own personal view of legalising the drug but its pretty obvious that next election if the greens and labour form a government the greens will be calling the shots and it will happen then anyway.

    National should score some points and make out that its on the cards and get a few swing voters on side. There are so many people coming out of the woodwork on talkback saying how they would prefer the teens smoking the real thing and not the synthetic crap that i dont think national would lose much support.

    • Gazzaw

      Totally disagree Nigel.The artificial crap has to go and I and I think the vast majority would like to see the importers and the corner dairy drug pushers put in the slammer – the former for as long a period as possible. Personally, I don’t care to what extent the law has to be changed to facilitate that. As for the premise that the Greens will legalise marijuana, well, I would challenge them to make that part of their election manifesto and see how they go.

      • johnbronkhorst

        Simply put: ” Two wrongs don’t make a right”!!

      • yeah i take your point and i wish that it could be so. But we know what the left are like. If they get in it will become legal so the right may as well capitalize. I think thats what they did with the marriage reform.

    • Patrick

      Legalise? Be buggered. Far better to sort out the laws & criminalise the synthetic dope. This sh1te is dangerous.

      • Polish Pride

        Yet the real stuff is safer than alcohol, tobacco caffeine and even cinnamon all of which are legal…

        • Gazzaw

          The real stuff is a blight on our society PP and just because you think its safer than alcohol is no reason to legalise it. BS to it being safer than caffeine or cinnamon (what’s that about?). As for tobacco, who gives a fuck? If people are thick enough to have a death wish then leave them to it – we’ve taken all the steps that we can. Modern cannabis is not in the same league as the old stuff, it has longterm negative health effects, is lethal in the workplace and on the roads and introduces our kids to the hard drugs culture. I don’t give a toss how many billions (your figure not mine) it costs to police cannabis, take it out of the welfare budget for all I care but police it we must.

          • Polish Pride

            No one in the history of cannabis use has ever died from overdosing on Cannabis it is people have died from too much caffeine. and do a google on cinnamon prank and you’ll find out the damage that can be done with a simple teaspoon of cinnamon.
            Make Cannabis legal with some education on how to use it and it will not be a blight on society. The only reason it could even be considered so now is because of the illegal activities that come with it as a result of it being in the control of the gangs.
            The vast majority of people who use cannabis do so with no detrimental effects whatsoever. You just don’t get to hear about this because its just better to keep your mouth shut and keep it to yourself under the current climate.

          • Travis Poulson

            So dickheads try to swallow a teaspoon of cinnamon as a challenge. If you are putting forward that as part of your argument then don’t forget to include everything else that can be harmful if misused or taken in excess.

            The fad involves daring someone to swallow a spoonful of ground cinnamon in 60 seconds without water. But the spice is caustic, and trying to gulp it down can cause choking, throat irritation, breathing trouble and even collapsed lungs

            source:http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2013/04/22/doctors-warn-of-cinnamon-challenge-dangers/

            Surely you can’t be using that as your argument…

          • johnbronkhorst

            and if someone swallowed an empty spoon (no cinnamon) they would probably also choke and die.
            We get upset about the abuse of alcohol, I have seen that the abuse of Dope (apt name by the way) is MUCH worse.

          • Gazzaw

            Totally agree John. The last thing this country needs is another legalised drug to add to the already very sorry list. The overwhelming opinion of the medical profession is against it, the cops are against it and if a poll were taken I am betting that the majority of the population would be against it. What is needed is a massive effort to rid the country of ALL illegal drugs regardless of the cost. And no PP I’m not a wowser and yes, I have seen firsthand what this shit can do to people.

          • Polish Pride

            Gazzaw I’m sure you have seen it first hand but let me ask you. Could you tell these people how to use it safely? What excessive use is and what the warning signs are and what to do about them?
            Another thing when both the cops and the gangs are against the legalization of cannabis you know something is not right. As for the medical establishment, that is rapidly changing as more and more medical uses are found.
            Here’s a scenario for you – a guy as a result of an accident (workplace) has chronic back pain, he has had a couple of operations, physiotherapy accuncture, prescription drugs from the doctor but nothing really helps or just creates other problems. He’s at the end of his rope. He tries Cannabis. It works the pain disappears. He decides to grow a couple of plants for personal use. He’s never been in trouble with the law and doesn’t want to be. He goes to the two local constables and explains his situation. He explains he only has it for personal use and If they take it from him and charge him. it won’t be long before they return to a suicide as this is the only thing he has found that gives him relief.
            Another scenario – A guy in a high stress job is diagnosed with severe depression. He goes to the doc who gives him some prescription drugs. They don’t help, he tries St johns wart, no help either, He has been severely depressed for about 8 months. He tries cannabis. for the first time in 8 months he feels happy again. not only that he finds his mood is lifted for an entire week without needing anymore.
            What do you do if you are one of the cops in the first scenario.
            In your view should either of these guys be allowed cannabis?
            remember there is multiple sides to every issue.
            The thing that I have found is that those who have seen the worst side tend to be in positions where they are likely to only see the worst side. This significantly colours their view and they don’t get to see the other side.

          • Gazzaw

            A medical scrip with the drug supplied by a pharmacist? Yeah, I’ll buy that as long as it comes with all of the conditions that apply to other prescribed sedatives and painkillers. There’s bound to be the odd transgression but they can be dealt with by the law. That’s as far as it needs to go though.

            Of course the gangs are against legalisation for the simple reason that its a major revenue stream for them and an intro for youth into the high profit margin stuff like P. The cops are against it because they know exactly what will happen if dope is legalised.

          • Polish Pride

            take a more objective look at the issue inline with other things that are legal and more dangerous. I doubt it will change your mind but who knows. I was once in the same camp you are.

          • Gazzaw

            What happened? You must have started smoking the stuff.

          • Polish Pride

            I’ll give you my story maybe you won’t give a shit maybe it will cause you to look a little further into the topic, maybe it won’t

            Son of a cop, I had it drummed into me drugs are bad – ALL OF THEM. They will ruin your life stay well away from them. I believed it and repeated exactly the same message for years.

            Never smoked cigarettes – disgusting habit. And partially to blame for my mothers death.

            Tried Alcohol – never liked the taste so never really got into it.

            I ended up getting my highs naturally from activities like surfing snowboarding and wakeboarding.

            I was pretty staunch on the anti drugs thing. Didn’t associate with anyone that did drugs. If I did my friends new my stance on it and kept any use well away from me.

            Any girlfriends were told in no uncertain terms – if you want to be with me, I have two rules. Don’t Smoke Don’t Do Drugs!

            Things were this way for over 15 years after leaving home.

            Good career good salary. Then I started a business.

            The business had a number of challenges as all businesses do It struggled big time and without going into too much detail I became severely depressed and had to step away from the business. I was away for about 8 months and left it in what I thought were the safe hands of my business partners (husband and wife) who defrauded it and on finding out I was forced to return to it boot them out and run it again. This time I had the right help (Lawyers, Accountants and a business savvy friend) which got things back on track I was the second guy in the earlier examples I gave you. The first was a situation that happened with my father when he was a cop. So both were real.
            Anyway and to this day I still don’t know why I did, I happened to walk into a shop that was selling synthetic cannabis. I decided to against everything I had been taught, try it.
            At home I did just that and had an amazing and euphoric experience. It made me question everything I had been told.
            I researched the hell out of it and found out a lot of very interesting information. Most importantly though I found out from the guy in the shop who was a chemist how it worked physiologically and how to use it safely.
            I took this info away and did even more research. One of the really sad things is that the info he told me on how to use it safely is on the internet but in pieces, you have to know what to look for and how the pieces fit together.
            I continued using the synthetics and credit them for helping lift me out of my depression. I then had a bad experience on the K2. The one that everyone says is bad.
            After that I switched to regular all natural cannabis.
            I really enjoy it. I use it once a week at most, no different to someone that has a responsible social drink on the weekend sometimes I will skip a weekend, sometimes I will skip two or three. If I start to feel depressed and I haven’t had any I have some and I am good as gold.
            If I have too much I will actually feel flat and a little depressed. But I know at that point I have overdone it and I don’t touch it until I am back to feeling normal as I know I have simply depleted my serotonin. Sort of like having a hangover from having had a little too much. But even that doesn’t happen anymore really as I know how much is enough.
            The thing I find really interesting is how simple activities that you might do take on a whole new meaning or are more beautiful when having had cannabis. Listening to music and hearing the separation of the instruments, Watching a movie that seems that much deeper, going for a walk in nature, colours seem more vibrant and everything seems really crisp and sharp.

            It has certainly changed my life for the better and it is sad that people do run into problems with it. No one needs to have any problems with it if only they could have easy access to information on how to use it safely. Without it though it is easy to see how those that do get into trouble do so.
            Smoke cannabis – get high, smoke some more – feel flat o depressed – So instead of stopping because their serotonin is depleted, they smoke more because last time it made them feel better and they exacerbate the problem. They end up on a downward spiral that would have been so easy to avoid if only they had been given the right information in the first place.
            In my view it would be safer if it were legalized for this very reason.

          • Polish Pride

            examples please given that 4 people died in the Wellington region alone last year from simply consuming too much alcohol I think you’ll be pushing shit uphill to prove your argument that cannabis is worse. The other key thing to consider is most people using cannabis don’t abuse it and many of them hold down very good careers whilst doing so but you won’t really hear about them in the media.

          • trisha

            Seeby Woodhouse, The founder of internet company Orco says Unlike Bill Clinton, I have inhaled. I’m not a big user. I’m a businessman, so I like my brain to be motivated, and marijuana chills you out …”
            http://www.nzherald.co.nz/television/news/article.cfm?c_id=339&objectid=10882649

            does he count as having a good career?

          • Polish Pride

            don’t know the guy personally but on the face of it… yes.

          • Ronnie Chow

            Alcohol is simply the best way to get high and also the most dangerous . The fun part is , it’s legal . Anyone who drinks is a druggie .

          • Polish Pride

            that is the whole point you can add so many things to the list – all prescription drugs even water and cannabis still comes out safer. That is how ludicrous it is that this drug of choice for many is illegal.
            The only reason it was made illegal in the first plce was as the result of a class war.

          • Hazards001

            BULLSHIT!

          • Polish Pride

            enlighten me with which part you think is bullshit hazards.
            Water perhaps? you can die from drinking too much water
            or water intoxication as it is correctly known. There has never been a single recorded death in all of history from smoking too much cannabis.

          • Hazards001

            My brother was a drug and alcohol councillor at Hamner Springs.(I however am not and simply listened to some of the things he told me) I have no intention of getting into a debate with someone that will drag up all sorts of bullshit facts on this issue off the internet. I will not go wasting my time trawling for rebuttals to spurious facts designed to fit the hop head community.
            THC is a seriously fucked up poison and I have no idea how many deaths it has caused but the number will be hideous. You will be doing what all other single issue fuckwits do and are hiding behind the wording. And I repeat I have no intention of going looking.

          • Polish Pride

            Funny thing is Hazards, being the grumpy old bugger you are, you’d probably really enjoy cannabis more than most. I’m guessing you already have a poison that your quite partial too already though ;0)

      • yeah but who IS sorting the criminals out? no one. cops just walk past people smoking regular cannabis these days. its a mess and needs to be sorted out. a whole generation is at stake. Legalising may be the lesser of several evils.

  • Mr_Blobby

    I see in the Sunday Horrid that Darwin has been working overtime. Once again a call to ban Police chases, what better way to encourage the morons.

    • williamabong

      Why bother, car chases have become the chlorine for our gene pool.

  • LesleyNZ

    A friend gave me this to read when my second son (now 30) was born………….
    (From a Christian perspective so I know there will be a lot of you who will disagree with what Elisabeth writes)
    “Called to be Mothers” – by Elisabeth Elliot.
    http://www.vietchristian.com/gospel/calledmother.asp
    You mean that’s all you do?
    That’s all? As a mother, your life is given to taking care of people–small ones, to begin with, whose wants never seem to cease. Sometimes when your days seem to be wholly taken up with wiping things–dishes and sinks, little runny noses and big slow tears–you wonder about what “fulfillment” is supposed to mean for you. You wonder about being (besides the perfect wife and mother) the hostess-with-the-mostest, creative, intellectually productive, beautiful… and slowly your dreams seem to evaporate.
    You’ve been listening to what they’re telling us nowadays about how important it is to find yourself, express yourself and assert yourself. Maybe you’re thinking that you’re nothing more than somebody’s wife and somebody else’s mother. And what kind of life is that?
    There is a tribe in the Southern Sudan called “Nuers” where a woman’s name is changed not when she becomes a wife, but when she becomes a mother. She is “ManPuk”–“Mother of Puka.” Among the Nuers, being someone’s mother is what makes a woman’s life meaningful. Two thousand years ago there was another young woman, of the Jewish tribe of Judah, who understood that truth. The world has never forgotten her–Mary, the mother of Jesus–because she was willing to be known as, simply, Someone’s mother.
    Motherhood is a calling. It is a womanly calling… and let’s not be cowed by those who extinguish the light and joy of sexuality by trying to persuade us to forget words like manly and womanly. At the beginning of time when God made the first man and the first woman in His image He put both under the divine command to be fruitful. The woman’s obedience to that command meant self-giving. First she gave herself to her husband–he initiated, she responded–then she gave herself for the life of her child.
    A woman knows, in the deepest regions of her being, that it is this very self-giving for which she was made. Single or married, her level of maturity is measured by how much she gives to others. If she’s married, she gives herself to her husband and she receives. If she’s a mother, she loses her life in her child and–mysteriously–she finds it.
    A woman knows that no one can really say where the giving ends and the receiving starts. It is no wonder we are confused when urged to look for some “better” or “higher” vocation in which to “prove our personhood.” No wonder we are distressed to be subjected to male standards, or told that the notions of femininity and masculinity are obsolete.
    Old fashioned notions they are indeed, but they weren’t our own to begin with. They were God’s. He planned the whole system, and it’s God Himself who calls. He calls some to be single, some married people to be childless, but He calls most women to be mothers. There are, the Bible tells us, “differences of gifts,” and they’re all given to us according to God’s grace. None of the gifts of my own life–not my “career” or my work or any other gift–is higher or more precious to me than that of being someone’s mother.
    If our calling is to be mothers, let’s be mothers with all our hearts–gladly, simply, and humbly–like that little peasant girl Mary who spoke for all women for all time when she said, “Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to Thy word” (Luke 1:38).
    © 2002-2005 Good News Publishers. Used by permission.
    1300 Crescent Street
    Wheaton, IL 60187
    U.S.A.
    TO ALL MUMS OUT THERE – HAVE A GREAT DAY.

    • Gazzaw

      Love your sincerity Lesley. I don’t always agree with you but your heart’s in the right place.

      • LesleyNZ

        Thanks! :)

  • Hazards001

    Looks like there is some integrity in Gilmore huh? Not much maybe…but some…at least he isn’t going to pull a weatherman on us…http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10883127

    Good riddance to him too, the emails Cam posted last night were just the absolute end of the numpty muppet.

    If I were him I’d be dusting off my CV to see if I could get a job at maccers…maybe a few years of “would you like fries with that Sir?” Will teach him the humility he has been so far lacking!

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