Joe Karam makes more bizarre claims

Joe Karam continues to malign a dead man and make bizarre claims. His latest claim is that Robin Bain was the last person to handle the gun…without explaining how there were no fingerprints of Robin Bain’s on the gun, the magazine, the silencer or the ammunition.

“The marks in question are not cuts, they are not abrasions, they are not burns.”

If the marks came off very easily … they cannot have been on very long. If they were from the day before they would have already rubbed off, Mr Karam said.

“They are sooty marks. They are on the same finger where deposits from loading a gun into a magazine [would have been].”

“Therefore Mr Bain was the last one to handle and use the gun.” 

“The two marks on the thumb match to the millimetre, the magazine.”

Oh really Mr Karam?

So, if you are to believe Joe Karam, Robin Bain was the last one to handle the gun, killed his entire family (except David because he was the only one who deserved to live), then wiped his prints from the gun, added David Bain’s instead when David was out, then placed the magazine in its thin end, the same magazine that didn’t have his prints on them either on its end, then shot himself and fell down with his hand right beside the upright magazine, and left greasy marks on his hand to prove he was the last one to handle the firearm. Oh and one mustn’t forget that dear old Joe has spent years explaining all this away by the fact that Robin Bain wore gloves that have never been found but took them off just after he killed himself and popped them int he washing machine all without disturbing the sooty marks on his thumb.

If you believe all that on top of all the other amazing things that you have to believe if you believe Robin Bain then I have a bridge I can sell you.


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  • grumpy

    Dear Queensland Harry,

    How much for the bridge?

  • Justsayn

    You forgot how the marks (that could so easily be lost) that came from loading the mag, were not lost when he washed all the blood from his hands and changed his clothes.

  • thor42

    I wish Joe K and “Funny Jerseys” would f**k off to Spain so we would never hear of them again.

    “Funny Jerseys” is as *guilty as sin.* The list of stuff that WO posted a week or two ago (none of which has *ever* been explained) was very damning.

    • Cadwallader

      “Joke Karam”

  • pukakidon

    Dont forget he fought with Steven shooting him in the hand and then transferred the injuries to Davids body including bruising and abrasions and splatters of blood on Davids clothing. .

    Does he think the whole country is full of idiots?

    • Yes I think he does

    • Chris

      Nah, David would make a great Warriors coach.

  • nudgy

    As an amateur sleuth I thought the fact Robin Bain had not had a piss before doing all those bizarre things Karam would have us believe would have been highly persuasive evidence. Binnie glossed over the full bladder evidence in his ridiculous report by saying Robin Bain at his age would probably have had an enlarged prostate which would have enabled him to murder his family without needing a leak. This despite the official autopsy not having checked Robin Bain’s prostate gland! Come on Joe stop takin the piss….

    • Bunswalla

      Not only that, an enlarged prostate gland actually makes you need to piss more often, and don’t forget June 5th was the coldest day of the year in Dunedin. I don’t know about you but when it’s cold and you have to have a whizz, you can barely hang on till the toilet. Well I am 93 and I don’t move as quickly as I used to… ;-)

      • Orange

        Are you seriously 93?

        • P1LL

          Did you not see the wink at the end of his post LOL

          • Orange

            umm, well he could have been kidding about not moving as fast rather than the age part? He seemed to have lots of practical experience on the prostate. I didn’t know I had one till the doctor pointed it out to me.

          • Rodger T

            And every male over 40 knows exactly how he pointed it out to you. LoL

        • Bunswalla

          Sure – give or take 40 years.

      • Rodger T

        So,where were you on the morning of the 20th June 1994,
        Hmmmmmmm, ?

        • Bunswalla

          I was out doing my paper-round, why do you ask?

          • Rodger T

            I lost a lens from my glasses, I was wondering if you might have found it?

  • LesleyNZ

    Joe Karam NEVER saw Robin Bain after he was murdered yet he knows all about him and assumes that he murdered his family. Joe Karam hasn’t a clue about what Robin Bain was like. Joe has continually blackened a dead man’s name to gain publicity for himself and David Bain. You (especially he) CANNOT make assumptions on a photograph. Just seen Joe on telly. He is so desperate to get the public on his side so that pressure will be put on Ministers to pardon David Bain and then Joe thinks he will get compensation he has been hoping for. Hope that Bryan Bruce gets TV1 to rescreen the two documentaries he did on David and Robin Bain so that our minds are refreshed as to what the true facts and forensic evidence is to do with case and the sequence of events. Still can’t work out why David Bain took so long to call the police, why he washed his bloodied clothes before calling the police and why his bloodied palm print was found on the washing machine – and then there is Stephen…..

    • pukakidon

      Don’t forget he admitted that he heard his sister gurgling and did not even try to help her. What a great guy.

      • Bunswalla

        Yep, he’s a prince all right.

    • Mallard the duck

      Money for nothing and chicks for free….them yo yo’s will be fooled by me,,,sings J Karam….on MTV….

  • pukakidon

    Did anyone notice the obvious? The finger prints the idiot was showing were of the center of the fathers thumb, where as the cuts shown in the photo are on the side of his thumb. Which incidentally is completely at odds with all the other examples of the other people loading the mag.

  • Bunswalla

    OK Joe, explain this to me: according to your sock-puppets Garner and Espiner, there were 19 bullets accounted for. David oops I mean Robin had a 10-shot mag and a 5-shot mag. That means he had to have reloaded at least one of the mags with at least 4 bullets – with me so far?

    If you get the sooty marks from reloading after it’s been fired, why doesn’t he have more than one set of marks, and why aren’t they over-lapping? Even if you tried to stretch and say he loaded one with his finger and one with his thumb, that still leaves two more bullets to reload, and two more sets of tracks. Where are they Joe?

    Either the marks only occur when you reload the first bullet (in which case reloading the other three would’ve rubbed them off – remember how easy you told us it was to remove them?), or Robin miraculously reloaded all 4 bullets precisely the same way (to the millimetre – remember you said that Joe?).

    There is of course another option – the marks (which are not even close to being parallel, don’t look like sooty smudges and are actually a different colour) are nothing to do with Robin reloading the magazine, and you’re talking out of your arse again.

    That would explain why there were none of Robin’s fingerprints on the barrel, but doesn’t explain how David’s and Steven’s got there. I think we both know how that happened, don’t we Joe?

    • P1LL

      Buns : I wish I could give you a thousand up votes for this post

  • Josh Metcalfe

    Boy, David Bain must be good root for Joe Karam to have fought for him all these years.

  • LinkinHawk

    If he had real new evidence that proved davids innocence why on earth would you ring up the media and tell them, you would think the first place to go would be the police.

  • Richard Jocelyn

    What’s with TV3 and the love fest with Karam/Bain. Pouring so much crap on the truth that nobody can figure it out :(

    • LabTested

      I could not work out why TV3 lead with this item on the 6pm news, particularly as at the end of the item they gave the police response, which was that the set of prints in question were of poor quality and could not be used.

      Karam has a copy of a bad set of prints. Head line news! – WTF

    • Mallard the duck

      One of the reason why I don’t watch TV3’s news.

  • opusx

    Joe is a truly bizarre individual. I’m sure he’s asked David on many occasions if he did the murders…but David has always looked him in the eye and said ‘no’. So clearly, and for that reason alone, it should be clear David is innocent. Because why, after befriending David…(and let’s be honest…going to bat for him like you would your own son), would he lie to Joe. The love Joe has for David can never be denied, it’s always been on public display. In fact I would go so far as to say he is obsessed with David. And herein lies the problem…why? And why do the MSM give him the time of day? That ones easy, to create division, anger and argument, therefore ratings. But really what are you left with… A sad old man being led down the garden path, being made to look a fool in the eyes of those he professes to seek the support of. It truly is sad, yes, but what makes me angry is he’s attempting to spend our money to weave the tale, when the reality is common sense will see David is never pardoned, ergo, no compensation.

    • pukakidon

      Karam could not give a toss about the murderer he is only after the compensation pay out he has a claim to.

      • opusx

        He certainly suffers tunnel vision. When you are not open to other opinions, or have the inability to constantly reassess evidence without emotion, you become detrimental to the TRUTH.

    • Mr Sackunkrak

      Karam is waiting for his pay-day. Compensation is what he is after because the former paper-boy has no money. In fact the former paper-boy owes us all for his board and keep for 13 years. Lets call it “evens” at absolute best.

      • Travis Poulson

        No lets not, lets recover the $400,000 or so paid to Karam in legal aid.

        • Mr Sackunkrak

          Good fucking point!

    • ross

      That raises an interesting question: if David woke up tomorrow and finally admitted to Joe that he really did kill his family, would Joe:
      a) accept the truth (and inform the media)
      b) pretend he had wax in his ears
      c) ask David if he was feeling OK
      d) tell David to stop being silly

      • Bunswalla

        e) Back slowly away to the door, close it quietly and get the fuck out.

      • DavidKNZ

        Slowly reach for the actual murder weapon ( which he has access to), load one cartridge and………………..

  • Photoshop User

    I opened the photos from the Herald in Photoshop.
    I used Photoshop to look at the RGB colour values of the marks.
    It shows the marks on Robin’s thumb are a dark red.
    Whereas it shows the test firing cartridge smudges are a dark gray.
    In other worlds, Robin’s thumb marks are closer to the colour of blood/scratches than they are to cartridge soot.

    • Bunswalla

      Top skills – wish I’d thought of that. In the photo they definitely look more red than gray to the naked eye; great to see the technology confirm it.

  • Mr Sackunkrak

    So fucking over Bain and hos mate.. My phone is off the hook. And I’ve gone for a long walk. Oh, and my wallet is snapped shut!

  • CheesyEarWax

    The more evidence Karam produces the more guilty D Bain looks. This whole case reminds me of the movie Just Cause.

  • snakebit

    I will give Joe K full marks for displaying such strength of conviction…. and also ten crazy points, but still, full marks.

  • Paxmannz

    This man wants to sell you a bridge ??!!
    This man has no thought of justice and truth wheresoever it my lead along with his two sidekicks .. one who wants to sue Bain and the other who rides shotgun for this trio of justice fighters ..

    Whale Oil .. give us all a fucking break !

  • dogit

    I am so over Joe. I have been wondering if one of the reasons he is trying so hard to get compensation for David is because he gets a cut. I am seriously concerned my tax money will head this way when I think the right an was charged to begin with. It would make my day for David to one day get the cojones to admit it all and I want to be there to see the look on Joes face. Wont happen though …

    • Bunswalla

      That’s definitely one of the reasons, he’s admitted he struck a deal with Bain to split any compensation. Bain is highly unlikely to ever admit his guilt – he’s managed to convince himself he didn’t do it.

  • ross

    David Bain, when interviewed in 2009 after his retrial, said “You would think that whether you believe that I’m innocent or whether you believe I‘m guilty, you’d say ‘well, if he’s guilty, he’s served his time, let him get on with life…’” That tells me he had no respect for his family. (Indeed, he hated his father.) To think that if he murdered 5 members of his family he believes he should be able to get on with his life, is not the sort of comment I’d expect from someone who claims to be innocent. At the same time, David said it was his “core belief” that he was innocent. A core belief is a strongly held belief that may or may not be true. I find it remarkable that David seems to be unsure whether or not he massacred his family.

    • Mark

      I would argue that a paltry 13 years for five murders is not time served at all.

  • Col

    He sure is a fighter. Tune in for the up coming result, spin the wheel who will win no one knows?

  • Random66

    I hope Judith Collins reads all these comments posted here and holds on tight to those purse strings because the common sense shown on here makes short work of Karam’s latest effort to get Judith to part with some money.

    • Travis Poulson

      Stay tuned tomorrow, when more of Karam’s ‘evidence’ gets debunked.

    • DavidK NZ

      I’ve written to Judith Collins, noting that her determination to find the truth rather than play the politics of expediency has hugely improved my respect for her party

  • John Doe

    I am absolutely delighted that Joe Karam has landed this new evidence in the public area, for the reason that it clearly annoys the hell out of all the bigoted and biased individuals comenting here, though clearly some of the commentators are not biased and in fact are actually trying to be reasonable and fair.
    I do not bother wasting any of my time arguing with bigots who are completely biased against David Bain (and always will be), and who are bereft entirely of even the slighest hint of neutrality in terms of evaluating the evidence as it it arises in this case.

    • ross

      Classy comment.
      Joe doesn’t annoy me in the slightest. I feel sorry for the old codger. So many of his close personal relationships have fallen by the wayside, and for what? So he can continue backing the wrong horse.

    • Rodger T

      Well, your impartial neutrality is fairly obvious, Just a shame you don`t have a clue about reality.

    • Lion_ess

      New evidence? Give us a break, Joe Karam is a desperate man fighting for his pay day.

      • Mallard the duck

        Joe Karam is desperate for a % of compensation from the crown. He has invested a lot of time and money and so far no pay back. Any bit of hope is better than no hope. You got to feel sorry for that guy betting the wrong horse. Time for a Tui….

    • LesleyNZ

      Calm down! Now that is an abuse of the word bigoted! You are a foul-mouthed ill-informed and uninformed person. Are you expecting a share of the compensation – you sound very desperate. Remember – it is not personal opinion/interpretation or hearsay that matters – it is the facts, forensic evidence and the chronological time line of what happened that day that matters.

    • Bunswalla

      Dude, calm down! Take a chill pill or something. I have to assure you that nobody here has the slightest bit of animosity towards David Bain at all. it’s nothing personal.

      it’s just, like, he killed all his family, and – well, some of us think that’s not what you should do.

    • Bunswalla

      Oh, and John? We like to work within the realms of physical possibilities on this site. You may have noticed that in the comments about Robin killing everyone while wearing gloves, but somehow getting gunshot residue on his thumb.

      How exactly are we supposed to suck Malcolm Burgess’s cock at the same time as brown-nosing him?

      Confused, of Mayfair.

    • LesleyNZ

      From today’s proverb.
      Proverbs 12:16 – A fool is quick-tempered, but a wise person stays calm when insulted.

    • pukakidon

      Read the evidence you idiot, You are typical of the thick bastards we have in this country. Media are your brain,

  • John Doe

    I apolgise for being offensive, but the vitriol expressed in these posts troubles me deeply and seems more like venting of the spleen rather than a dispassionate analysis. Frankly, I am not interested in ‘toing-and-froing’ over every little bit of circumstantial evidence, nor attributing guilt or innocence in this case. Rather, my sole concern is to see fairness is done and I believe that that has been done by Justices Binnie’s report along with the judgment handed down by the Judicial Committe of the Privy Council.

    If any concern arises from Binnie’s report, then that needs to be dealt with by way of a transparent process, which has certainly not occurred in this case.

    Usually when a higher power overturns a judicial decision because of iiregularities then it goes back to that decision-maker and in this case should go back to Justice Binnie to address.

    I am disturbed by the fact of this matter being re-litigated relentlessly in the court of public opinion when it should by dealt with in a judicial setting such as with Justice Binnie.

    This whole situation has become an absolute charade and has nothing vaguely reminiscent of justice and fairness; instead it has descended, as it will always remain, into a world of prejudice, bias and irrationality.

    I will now tune out of this one because it fucks me off in the extreme and will never be satisfactorily resolved!