Just one vote, a wafer thin majority?

Labour and those who oppose are constantly banging on about the fact that the GCSB Bill will be passed “with a single vote” or passing it with “a wafer thin majority”.

This is ridiculous. Patently and demonstrably ridiculous.

Are they seriously suggesting that this is not democratic? It would appear that they are, they go on and on and on about it…watch parliament…speaker after speaker uses the lines “passed with a single vote” or passing it with “a wafer thin majority”.   

If they are seriously suggesting that a majority of our parliament isn’t democratic then how would they explain the defeat of the bill by “a single vote”…they were certainly begging for a National MP to cross the floor the other night in the Town Hall in Auckland…but surely that wouldn’t be a mandate either…surely that should be ignored if they defeat the bill by just a single vote.

It is ludicrous in the extreme.

At the least though they have set themselves up for the same silly arguments when they are in government and have just a single vote keeping them there.

 


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  • Jmac

    Wafer thin…anyone thinking of that Python sketch?

  • johnbronkhorst

    After shearers little revelation yesterday, re meeting with John Key, this “wafer thin” majority was obviously MANUFACTURED from the very beginning, the whole “spying” rhetoric was manufactured from the beginning.
    Labour KNEW the law was all about tidying up the 2003 law because that law was the one that allowed spying, not this one!!!

  • Jonathan Pull

    Democratic meand 51% passes. Do I like it on such serious issues? No.
    Will I complain about it like its some massive injustice? No as much as I dislike it and as narrow as it is, its democratic.

    Ive always believed that on serious issues such as the gcsb that involve POTENTIAL spying to reqiure a larger majority tham 51% because that leaves a massive minority?
    Of course thats just a pipe dream.

    • sheppy

      If the lefties weren’t concerned about point scoring at all costs this would be possible. However whilst they persist with their “we didn’t think of it so we’re going to oppose it just to maybe score a couple of political look at me points” antics it’ll never happen no matter what the merits of the bill or what the majority of MP’s think.

      • Jonathan Pull

        You think national dont just point score aswell?
        All political parties do it.

        • johnbronkhorst

          National don’t need to, labour score enough own goals!!

        • sheppy

          I do think they point score, but not all the time via anyone that will listen and usually not just for the sake of it.

      • BobaJob

        Clearly they’re ignoring the facts sheepy. The one vote majority vs wafer thin just doesn’t stack up on the balance of evidence.

        That one vote majority never looked like no friggin wafer!

        • sheppy

          Given that Shearer had a secret meeting about it that he chose to forget I’d expect if petty party politics weren’t involved that it wouldn’t be wafer thin. OF course that wouldn’t appease the left…
          If your that worried I’d suggest looking at the rest of the world where you don’t have any privacy at all. In the UK for example councils used their spy legislation to check that kids were going to the correct schools based upon where their parents lived.

          • BobaJob

            Eh? worried ? The sooner the GCSB bill goes through the better maaaaate. Then the scared ones will see that the sky is not falling on them. Poor buggers think that dagging season is the end of the world.

          • sheppy

            I’m not worried, clarifying a law that was screwed up at birth by labour is hardly worrying material

          • BobaJob

            Never said you were worried. I was responding to you,
            re: ‘If your that worried……..’

            That’s the second time you’ve misunderstood me or twisted what I’ve said – are you doing it deliberatley?

          • sheppy

            Nope, just got the wrong end of the stick!

          • BobaJob

            Thanks for that, I’ve had that end on more than a few occasions myself!

          • Jonathan Pull

            The only reason it needed to be clarified was because of illegal spying (done by both the current and previous government).
            If spying on NZ citizens isn’t a regular thing why the need for such great haste?

  • snakebit

    Just you wait until next year when labour, greens and mana try to stitch a government together with the ballot box dregs…if national is only a few percent short im sure they will change thier tune. Even if national had a moral mandate to form a govt the left would appose it and we could end up with a three or four party govt of crooks, idiots and terrorists. Pray for a clear magority.

    • AngryTory

      A government that does not include the largest party by far will be widely seen as illegitimate. It’s as simple as that. There is no precedent in NZ for such an undemocratic result.

      Whale (and Key) should shout this fact from the rooftops between now and the election.

      An “Egyptian Solution” would be preferable to a “coalition of the losers” running NZ!

    • BobaJob

      Can’t see that happening Snakey, NZ’ers like sensible governments that have good sensible forward thinking policies.

      We don’t mind a PM that can project his power and crush any detractor at will either. Bonus really.

      • IWantToBeLikeMallardOneDay

        So how did we get 9 years of Clark and Cullen?

        • BobaJob

          A reaction to the 15 odd year of extreme right wing reforms, 1st Labia and then the Nats.

          We don’t like the extremes in here in middle NZ- Aunty Helen and Co went extreme in that 3rd term. And that’s was the end of the road for them.

  • Guest 2

    Whale Oil I really hope you get some info on that very secret meeting between David Shearer and John key.

    I am waiting with baited breath on this story.

    David Shearer obviously doesn’t trust Russell Norman or his other party members.

    I cant believe he said what he said yesterday.

    From what I can read – David Shearer knows alot more about the GSCB laws, the problems with it and the fact that he is breaking confidence with the other means of the committee.

  • BobaJob

    I am only one vote and I count, that’s why I love democracy.
    One vote – eat that ;)
    Gobble gobble

    • AngryTory

      You should count because you have a a state in society.

      Bludgers, cogders, troughers – all those whose property and income depend on nett taxpayers have no stake and should have no vote.

      • IWantToBeLikeMallardOneDay

        A stake… :-)
        So I guess you’re intending on disenfranchising most of NZ’s wealthiest people, haha. Poor Bob Jones…

  • Phar Lap

    One vote majority for Nats seems to be working.Todays Dom Post latest political poll gives the Nats a commanding lead.Morgan Poll eat your heart out.

  • Hollyfield

    On the bright side, at least they’ve finally worked out that the Government does indeed have a mandate.

  • Col

    A pass is a pass in exams. If Labour was in they would be happy with Noddy Normans vote. Anyone seen Metiria Turei lately?

    • MarcWills

      I saw her from behind in Parliament yesterday, but she never had a speaking part for the time I was watching. And had left after Question Time when the debate on Shearer’s SOP was in progress.

      • Col

        I reckon something has happened to her, could be in for a sex change, as they need someone with real balls in the Greens.

  • Mr_Blobby

    Has nobody noticed that been Dunn and dusted was initially not supporting the bill, was effectively spied on when they released his private information and is now supporting the bill.

    This is the issue, the shear volume of private information that is being collected potentially for ever and can be accessed by relatively low level operatives. Technically only with a warrant, but it is available regardless with few safeguards.

    • johnbronkhorst

      NO politician, within the confines of parliament, should expect privacy. With the power they have, they should EXPECT their communications to be “requested” at any time.

      • Patrick

        Exactly, they are employees, they are using company equipment. On top of that as you say the level of power they have, the scope for corruption means they have to be whiter than white. Anyone these days that is using corporate email or phones for private “titillation” ala Dunne cannot whine when their communications are investigated. Do it in your own time using your own equipment.

        • johnbronkhorst

          Time to look at ALL MP’s EMails, especially labour and greens!!

  • AngryTory

    Anyone who doesn’t think that everything they do online is not being archived forever by the GSCB, ASIO, GCHQ, NSA, FSB & MSS are completely fucking naive. (Not to mention Whale). completely and utterly.

    They may as well join the Greens.

    • FredFrog

      Anyone who believes that any government organisation has the resources to store every byte of data generated within their country’s borders indefinitely (Quite apart from the data they’re intercepting externally) is completely fucking naive

      • AngryTory

        pedants: read “may not be” for “is not being”.

        the assumptions under which you operate are the same in either case

        • FredFrog

          Should those with nothing to hide really care? After all, before any data can be harvested, there needs to be a compelling reason to harvest it. It seems the assumptions under which you operate preclude that very basic fact.

          • Jonathan Pull

            The data is harvested and then Key word searches are used to trawl through the data examining files with those key words.
            Well Im sure thats how the states do it and will likely happen here.

          • FredFrog

            And before any data can be harvested, there needs to be a compelling reason for the Prime Minister to sign off on the warrants, or don’t you understand that bit of the legislation?

          • Muffin

            He chooses not to and is just trying to perpetuate the scaremongering from the left. The whole thing will be forgotten in a weeks time.

          • Jonathan Pull

            Scaremongering from the left???
            It was the Prime Minister who was trying to instill fear with threats of terrorists in our back yard.
            Nice try though.

          • Muffin

            Piss off pull its your pinko mates and your useless Labour Party trying to derail a bill the Labour Party leader actually supports in private so they can say they got one over the nats. A week from now you will have to find something to sook about because no one will care about this anymore

          • Jonathan Pull

            Im not arguing that anymore, I was replying to your comments about the left scaremongering when The Fuhrer has been doing it himself to try and scare people so they will stop opposing the bill.

            The same way a week from now you’ll find something to piss and moan about.
            And the world goes on,

  • AngryTory

    One vote in this parliament – elected under MMP by bludgers, codgers & state employee troughers – is more than enough of a mandate for any National government.

    On current polls, under a FPP vote John Key’s National Party would win every single electorate except Auckland Central, Hutt South & Wigram. Every single other electorate would go to National. A far geographical map of NZ would be 98% BLUE

    Key should govern on that basis. Or as someone said: we won. you lost. eat shit and DIE COMMIE SCUM

    Frankly, I’d send in the STG to the Labour & Green “party congresses” after telling ’em not to fuck up like they did in Ruatoria.

    • sheppy

      Too true, its very sad that the majority in parliament can’t win a seat outright yet still get to trough it up and waste time on non issues.

      • BobaJob

        What’s to be sad about the last 5 years?

        Edit: The last two democratically elected governments have been good kiwi National governments.

        That’s the way we like it – we’re not a failed state – we friggin rock!

        • sheppy

          Totally agree, the only thing I lament is that progress is stalled at every opportunity by idiots intent on trying for power at any cost.

        • AngryTory

          What’s to be sad about the last 5 years?

          * a complete absence of any actual Right-wing policy?
          * squandering the biggest disasters NZ will have in a generation?

          Imagine if Ruth was finance minister: there wouldn’t be any dole, DPB, KiwiSaver; there wouldn’t be any unions; there would only be effectively private charter schools and hospitals; there wouldn’t be any KiwiBank or KiwiRail or Kiwi-Whatever; all of the SOEs would have long been sold;

          and for sure: no adopting Labour/Green policies on “Affordable” Housing, RailFrootLoop, school meals, student loans, WFF…

          Ask yourself what should have been, then ask yourself if you’ve got anything more than a prettier face on Hellen Clark’s policies.

  • parorchestia

    Are Labour and the Greenwackies not worried about our security or not concerned to tidy up sloppy law passed earlier by Labour? Have they ever heard of Traitors? Or are they trying to protect them?
    Surely, they would have been better advised to cooperate with the government over this necessary bill to make it better and more effective bill rather than ridiculous screaming and points scoring.
    This is another demonstration of their incompetence and unfitness to occupy the treasury benches. Economically inept and even dangerous, now they cannot ensure the security of our citizens.
    We could dismiss them as twits if only they did not pose such a threat to our well being and security.

  • LesleyNZ

    They can just shut their mouths. They didn’t say this about the MMP referendum – which was “wafer-thin”. Politicking Hypocrites!

  • Angry Andy

    a win by 1 is Still a Win!! Bloody sour grape loosers. Isn’t what democracy is all about?. They have the stupid MMP, even though Not 1 of the green talibans were voted in any electorate seats, they have somehow got thru’ the back hole doors and the tail wagging Labia.’s dog.

  • G34

    Is Rupert Murdoch in charge of TV1 news? After listening to the news tonight with the first 17 mins of anti government GCSB and every other story aimed at the government In fact the whole news had an anti government theme
    Obviously nothing else is happening in the world worth telling NZ public about, so nice to have overseas news channels to watch to know what is happening

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