Oh look, the left are trying to destroy even more businesses

What is it with the left that they are so adverse to business making money?

Some companies are exporting millions of litres of bottled New Zealand water, and paying very little in return.

One company, Oravida, takes 400,000 litres a day from an aquafer in the Bay of Plenty. Last year they paid $526 in compliance fees.

The Green Party’s spokesperson for water, Catherine Delahunty, says the Government isn’t doing enough to protect New Zealand’s assets.

“Aucklanders don’t leave the tap running because there’s a charge on it and they value it, but Oravida and other companies can take it away, basically for nothing. That’s just wrong.”

Most Aucklanders pay a metred charge for water and wastewater services. In other parts of New Zealand, water maintenence is included in rates charges.

But Minister Nick Smith says the bottled water industry make up “diddly-squat” of water take, and “it would be unfair to charge them for water use any more than the thousands of other water users who use so much more.”

Minister Smith says there’s “no common sense” in targeting water bottlers when dairy farmers used 400 litres of water to produce one litre of milk.

Has Catherine Delahunty seen how much water flows out into the sea every day without anyone paying for it?

She also doesn’t take into account that the bottling company is paying wages, salaries, PAYE and GST.

The suppliers of bottles, caps and labels will also be benefiting.

And the plant won’t have just appeared on-site for free either.  It requires maintenance and repair.

When people in towns and cities paid for water, they pay for the network, the maintenance, the sanitation, the delivery, the operating costs and the profit.   This isn’t the same as a plant that bottles at the source.

People in cities and town pay for wastewater management.  This isn’t the same as a plant that bottles at the source.

The whole thing is a beat-up, and once again, it wouldn’t have gone anywhere if it wasn’t for a lazy media grateful for yet another SHOCK HORROR OMG ORAVIDA cut and paste.

If the Green Party can run  a 400,000 litre a day bottling plant to health standards, pay everyone involved, and only cough up $526 a year for it, then they need to leave politics now and all get into the industry.


– Story, Newshub


THANK YOU for being a subscriber. Because of you Whaleoil is going from strength to strength. It is a little known fact that Whaleoil subscribers are better in bed, good looking and highly intelligent. Sometimes all at once! Please Click Here Now to subscribe to an ad-free Whaleoil.

  • Spiker

    I drive past the Oravida bottling plant at Otakiri frequently. I’m surprised it’s taken the left this long to create a scandal about it. Perhaps they didn’t know it existed during the last round of Oravida bashing.

    I wonder what the feeling in the smoko room is like today? Do the left not care that when they attack companies for their own personal political reasons they are putting jobs of real people at risk? More being added to the missing millions I reckon.

  • Maisie

    Mr Maisie will vouch for me when I say that seeing CD mouthing in about this on Tv yesterday I was yelling at her about those mentioned above, wages GST etc etc. some people need their heads read if they believe her ravings. By the way, the taxpayer pay her, for what?

  • Pete

    Not only people in towns and cities are paying to have water flow from a tap. A commercial produce grower dependent upon irrigation to get a marketable crop must place a well, install and maintain pumps and a reticulation system, and as required, periodically renew a consent to take the water necessary to produce the crop. It is costly and that cost forces efficient use of the water and a well maintained system to do so.

    Adding in a charge for the water would not help a vegetable grower working in a complex and consumer demand lead business.

  • Day Day

    They don’t want people drinking sugar laden drinks, or healthy drinks with no sugar?

  • Blockhead

    Where might this thinking logically lead to?
    If the water, which initially falls from the sky, should be charged for, then so should the wind which turns those ugly windmills the Greens love. And of course people using solar panels are taking free energy, so they should pay for that too.
    If the Greens started their thinking from a principles base, they might not make so many stupid comments.

    • Skydog

      Should oil that is also a natural resource be free?

      • Mighty1

        I think if you dig it up then it is yours.

      • Seriously?

        That is slightly different. Firstly there is a law that carves that out giving ownership to the Government.

        More importantly, there is only so much oil. If you could look at a reserve of oil you could say that thing there is what I own. Go away and come back and you are looking at the same oil.

        With water, like wind or sunlight, you cannot to that. You might look at a part of a river or aquifer, but the water that is there will no longer be there if you close your eyes for a bit. Different water will have taken its place. So if you own the water, which water are you taking about? It gets conceptually hard, and hence why the longstanding proposition has been that you cannot own water in its natural state, but suck it into a pipe or a bottle or whatever and then you can own it as then it is ascertainable.

        • Joe Burns

          Great Myth. “More importantly, there is only so much oil”

          At any one time, probably so. But who gave the lie that that quantity is for all time? It was and is still being made right now. What we have today started life as a forest some x millions of years ago.

          • Seriously?

            What I mean is that it is any particular oil deposit is ascertainable. Any particular oil deposit will not grow over time, even millions of years, and the oil that is in it today will be the same oil that is in it next week.

            Sure new reserves might be created over long time periods, but that is a different story altogether.

        • biscuit barrel

          Coal, oil, uranium, gold in the ground is owned by government. may even be a few others.

          • Seriously?

            Yes, but like the oil example, they are all ascertainable.

    • Mighty1

      What about the air on top of the water in the bottle? Who owns that? Is it paid for? Don’t tell the greens!

  • Second time around

    The truth is that the Chinese can make clean water even in Beijing and bottle it under any name they like- a well known beer brand is made under licence in Beijing and sold in NZ supermarkets. They could even use a Maori-sounding name to market the water, observe that it has the same mineral content as some NZ aquafer, and not one cent of the wages or production costs would come to NZ.

  • Abjv

    Unify two policies. Put a price on water. Charge commercial users – exporters, farmers, businesses, hotels, beer factories, meat works, schools, anyone who uses water, for the water itself. Question why everyone is not paying, charge domestic users for non-domestic use e.g. Filling swimming pools, washing cars, ware blasting. Why stop there, much easier to put a per litre charge on water itself and charge everyone for all use. Use the money raised to pay the UBI.

  • Seriously?

    People with water meters are not paying for the water, they are paying for the costs in getting it to them.

    Take Auckland. Watercare pays no more for the water than any of these bottling plants, their costs come from treating it and getting it to your tap. Watercare is not making massive profits as a result.

    In user pays terms, it makes sense that if you use more than me, you should pay more than me for toward the costs of provision. Also, if you have to pay by quantity you are likely to be more careful about how much you use. Hence water meters.

    • biscuit barrel

      Watercare is prohibited by law from making a profit, and if they have a ‘surplus’ by chance they cannot pass it to their owners, the Auckland ratepayers

  • Anthony

    An Auckland water meter is more about paying for wastewater.

  • Canucktoo

    Has Catherine not heard of the hydrologic cycle? – the stuff we learned about in school!! Water ends up in aquifers via precipitation ultimately – no one owns clouds! If we don’t touch it it returns to the sea where it evaporates & the whole process starts over again – it’s probably ‘Aussie’ water Oravida are harvesting!!!!

    • Seriously?

      Science is secondary to ideology for the Greens.

      These are the same people who, in their Greenpeace guise, campaign against the introduction of Golden Rice – a excellent product that is available for free and would addresses vitamin A deficiencies that see the deaths of 1 to 2 million people (mostly children) annually, not to mention additional cases of blindness.

      Why do they oppose it? Simply because is the is result of genetic modification. Not because of any risk, just as a matter of principle.

      And their campaign works because we are too weak kneed to tell them to get lost, and the public are too gullible to see their principles are unprincipled.

  • oldmanNZ

    “400,000 litres a day from an aquafer in the Bay of Plenty.”
    “Aucklanders don’t leave the tap running because there’s a charge on it”

    Auckland is a bit different from Bay of plenty (about 230km apart and has it has plenty of water)

    its like someone complaining why i can buy a house in Tokoroa for $250k but in auckland it cost $800k?

  • Skydog

    A great thing about WO is that I don’t always agree with everyone’s views. I think the Greens and NZF are on to a winner here.

    New Zealand has the luxury of having vast amounts of the most valuable resource to man. Why on earth would we want to virtually give it away? In the early days when the Saudi’s realised they sat on huge oil fields, did they think, well there is so much, lets just be satisfied that someone will come and create jobs and pay maintenance? They had the sense they would take a slice of the pie (royalty rates).

    I don’t agree with John Key when he says no one owns water. Would the PM also say the Saudi’s don’t own the oil?. No overseas company should be able to take 400,000 litres of water without pay royalties.

    The water in NZ belongs to NZ. It is our good fortune we have this resource. It’s our good luck that clouds bring us rain. So lets take advantage of our good fortune and charge royalties on water that is taken from the country.

    • Urbanviper

      The great irony being however that the left wing traditionally is against turning water, a basic of life, into a commodity. There is outrage any time a private company says they own or want to own water, or that water management could be solved by letting the ‘market take care of it’. But it shows how wacky New Zealand politics has become that the left wing has embraced turning it into something that can be bought, sold and privatized while National is saying ‘no, no it is a public resource and not to be privatized’.

    • Doc45

      I dont agree with your theory but I can tell you even a small royalty would sink most water bottling companies. Freight and promotion costs are huge.

    • Brian Dingwall

      Let the market establish the price……nothing fairer…..to both buyer and seller

  • quantummechanics66

    I said 10 years ago that NZ has 2 resources that will make us the envy of the world, water & oil. We should put a charge on water, not let it leave NZ for free. Will not need to be much, maybe 2-10c/m3. NZ mineral water is an exotic and perceived value added product so it should have a charge.

    • Brian Dingwall

      Hasn’t the market already put a price on? It is conceivable the price is actually negative as councils which have control over water of the quality sought discount the product itself as they compete to attract employers….

  • NZ_Stormer

    Garner on his dive show yesterday reckons Oravida is the Chinese arm of the National Party. Said virtually the same on Story later on.

  • Positan

    Green Party proposals are as depth-limited as its MPs’ cranial capacity.

  • Urbanviper

    It is always the “I pay for it so why shouldn’t they” argument. They forget of course that local councils have to pump and get the water to your house, all while making sure it is safe to drink, whereas these companies purchase land, pump the water and do all that themselves before bottling it.

  • cows4me

    The Melons are just spewing because they are way to thick and slow to dream up a business such as this. They are just showing a strong trait of socialism, envy.

  • richard.b

    Is this not a council issue?
    Company A applies for a consent to take x m3 of water.
    Council has a fee structure ans says the will be $512 p/a. Done deal.
    You cannot now go back to Company A and say “Sorry, you are making too much money, and we want to clip the ticket now.”

    • biscuit barrel

      yes especially when they would have the same charge for farmer Brown down the road who has his own bore. Farmers vote!

  • JohnO

    400,000 lites per day is 400 cubic metres per day and is equal to the water in a 7.3 metre x 7.3 metre by 7.3 metre deep swimming pool. That is a tiny amount of water by NZ standards that oravidia is bottling and selling and creating wealth out of to enrich themselves and the rest of the country. Where is the problem with using resources to make us all wealthy?

    • biscuit barrel

      Thats so right. There are two bottling plants in this flyspeck town, local jobs, exports,whats not to love.

    • Seriously?

      Especially resources that would otherwise simply go to waste – leach out to sea. If it makes the Greens happy they ought to think of it as recycling a waste product.

  • Kevin

    The Left actually believes big corporations are out to “steal” all the water and leave nothing for the farmers.

  • Dan

    You can bet your house on the fact that Oravida will be paying a lot more than $526 in tax each year.

    Another point is that the Greens will most liklely be buying plastic water bottles every day as a healthy alternative to those evil sugary ones. Hopefully NZ water but if not then from a small town in the French Alps or a certain nearby Tropical Island. Either way they are only paying about 5 cents for the water. The rest being packaging.

  • Jude

    I am surprised that Maori have not claimed ownership of the water and have not demanded a payout from the sales made!

    • Spiker

      This is why water must remain without any owner. Can you imagine the number of carriages on that gravy train if water could be claimed by any group, or individual for that matter.

    • Seriously?

      They have, in an electricity generation context but the principles are the same. It failed because in New Zealand law, no one owns the water. I’m sure if that were to change, they would reconsider their claim.

  • Left Right Out

    The irony is the left are paying absolutely nothing for the air they breath….. yet it seems to contain something the rest of us aren’t getting…. maybe we should introduce a stupidity tax for them

  • Charlie

    Obviously the left would rather promote Coca Via over the great evil of our times “WATER”.
    How dumb are they?

  • WBC

    Wow, only $526 on compliance fees! I bet they don’t pay more then $300 on napkins for office lunches either!

    What’s your point Catherine?

  • So the Greens are demanding a price for water (one of the few real “public goods”) at the exact same time owing are trying to negotiate water rights. Co-incidence?

  • Keanne Lawrence

    Yet another non issue from a pesky list MP that doubtless is driven by envy or perhaps a hidden agenda. One who arouses suspicion every time she stands to ask a question in the house by trying to use a native dialect.

  • Asian_driver

    So how much water does CCA take every day, another big multinational stealing the water. The funny thing is the water stays in the system if we export some them some water from another country will rain on our country, heck we might not even be bottling our own water it could be Russian or Vietnamese water

  • Old Chook

    Only $526 in compliance fees in the BOP. For our orchard the resource consent for our bore was over $3k per annum to Enviroment BOP. I am sure they will be paying more than that all up, if still orcharding I would be buying them a beer or two to find out how they have managed to get around paying the thieving councils.

  • Elmwood

    What is the fixation with water? I keep banging on about company’s like BOC getting our air for free, bottling the components of it and flogging it off for profit. No one complains. Don’t get me wrong, I think making money out of an abundant resource is wonderful.