Whaleoil General Debate

keep-calm-and-don-t-shoot-the-messenger-3Morning everyone, and welcome to Whaleoil’s daily General Debate post (another one called Backchat will start at 6pm). To participate you’ll need to register a free Disqus account.

There are some rules, and if there is one thing about Whaleoil that you need to know is that these rules are dispassionately and strictly enforced.


THANK YOU for being a subscriber. Because of you Whaleoil is going from strength to strength. It is a little known fact that Whaleoil subscribers are better in bed, good looking and highly intelligent. Sometimes all at once! Please Click Here Now to subscribe to an ad-free Whaleoil.

  • johcar

    Moving day for me today – eagerly awaited….

    I think I have organised everything and planned for every contingency I can think of (when it comes to the big things, I’m a planner, not a seat-of-the-pants kinda guy). But I am sure something will crop up that I haven’t foreseen!

    Friends coming to help this morning with the final packing and cleaning and the unpacking at the other end.

    Busy day ahead.

    • Prediction: your Internet will not “cut over” today.

      • johcar

        I can confirm that prediction already. There is no broadband at the new address. Chorus appointment next Tuesday to organise the fibre install. Mobile BB for me in the meantime.

        • Get ready for drama. Possibly extended drama. Even with my powers and my connections I could not make it happen any faster. Even got labelled as “priority”, which helped nothing at all. ;)

          • johcar

            There is already fibre in the house, just no ONT installed. Hopefully, this means it will be straight-forward. Though having been involved in the industry for the last ten years, I should probably know better….

          • “Hopefully, this means it will be straight-forward”


          • johcar

            Well, the Chorus van turned up last thing yesterday (Friday, 4pm) because they had had some cancellations. The did the “blow through” of the fibre and connected it at the road (which I thought has already been done) and at the house.

            So they passed on this fact and my cell number to the guy who does the installs and he will either call me next week to arrange a flying install (if he has a cancellation), or I will see him Tuesday week as scheduled.

            Apparently, they like doing the installs in this area because everything has already been done by the subdivision developer, so they can be in and out quickly and make a quick dollar.

          • Cross fingers! Nothing wrong with being the exception to the rule ;)

    • Isherman

      Having been in the removals business I can only suggest making sure all access ways are kept as clear as possible, its the biggest help. If you dont do it every other weekend, pull the fridge and washer out and clean behind / underneath them…it helps keep the movers boots and clothes a bit cleaner.
      Glad you’re looking forward to it, it has been described as one of the most stressful things you will do in your life, and having watched some people go through it, I can see where they got the idea.

      • Chris EM

        Last time I shifted house, I thought never again, that was nearly thirty years ago.

      • johcar

        I’m a sucker for punishment. Done all the high stress activities in the last six months: marital split, along a house, buying a house…

        Luckily my bypass was 12 years ago (almost to the day), otherwise I’d be worried about a heart attack!!!

        • Mikex

          Been there, done that. Remember ” as one door closes another opens…” is true. Hope the day goes smoothly.

    • dumbshit

      Some “beaurocrat” will put a spanner in the works. Certainly, many hands make light work when moving house.

    • XCIA

      As long as you have access to tea/coffee and chocolate biscuits, you will be fine ;-)

      • johcar

        And beer. And wine!! :)

    • Disinfectant

      Hope all goes smoothly for you johcar.
      My move is part way through, with final day on Sunday after five and a half years.
      I’m expanding my business as well. My document shredder runs hot after a few minutes, as a move is a good time to clear the decks. I have had three garage sales and a charity collection.
      I’m putting most of my stuff in storage as I am also moving to another town to establish another base for my business. Most of that part is well planned and sorted so I can hit the road running on arrival. And it all costs a lot of money.
      But here’s the scary part. I don’t have any place to move into in the new town. Again, there is a huge accommodation crisis. So I am turning up with enough clothing and business “bits and pieces” to keep me going for a week. By being there will give me a good incentive to find somewhere to live.
      Fortunately I am now quite tech savvy and can take payments over my mobile for both Eftpos and credit card transactions and can now pay for my own purchases and expenses by waving my mobile phone over the card reader.
      But this morning I am tired and have another day with many things to do.

    • LabTested

      Many many years ago I was doing a move for Mum’s partner. He was a real egg head, extremely intelligent but with no common sense. Me & 2 of my mates turned up and started loading the van. While lugging the fridge out we ‘discovered’ it had not been emptied prior – a complete mess

      • I once helped someone move flats. They had hired “2 men and a van”

        One of them was a Mongrel Mob guy. His face was fully tattooed, down the neck and goodness knows where else. MONGREL was across his forehead.

        He was the quiet type.

        We’re all lugging stuff out, and as the flat empties we’re down to the big items like the whiteware.

        I had put all the frozen food into 3 rubbish bags and placed them inside the freezer for as long as possible, so I could take it out easily and pop it back in while it was in transit, etc.

        He walks up to the freezer – this is a full height standing unit, and I told him not to because it’s full of frozen food.

        He stares at me for a few seconds, hugs the freezer, picks it up and walks out with it. By himself.

        That was extremely intimidating!

    • jonno1

      Good luck! Lots of helpers is the key. We move infrequently, but have made it our practice to buy before selling, so that the move is on our terms. In fact, we’ve already bought our next dwelling and rented it out. But it doesn’t always work out as planned, eg last time we put the old house on the market after shifting, it sold within a couple of days and the new owner wanted a quick settlement. It still had half of our stuff in it so we had to wiggle our tails big time. Fortunately the new house was bigger; not so this time, we’re downsizing again.

  • edenman

    I was watching Sky News UK live last night when i saw an item on gender identity. After listening I pinched my self to make sure I was awake, then checked it wasn’t April 1sr. I then looked on the internet for confirmation, Yes, an English council is asking parents of 4 yr olds who have children starting school what gender their children identify as.
    They are only 4 yrs old and I am sure that every Chloe, Mohamed, Fatima or Sebastian were easily Identified at birth as biologically male or female. they should have been brought up accordingly and they should be identified on enrollment as what they were biologically identified at birth.
    4 year olds wouldn’t have a clue about gender identity let alone spell it. The world is going more loopy more quickly than I had imagined

    • MaryLou

      Well, considering the average 4 year old I’ve met generally identifies with “cat”, things can only go downhill.

  • Kiwiracer

    Human nature is a funny beast and how we let our perceptions control some of our thinking.

    The left think the MSM is way right leaning. . .

    The right think the MSM is way left leaning. . .

    All regarding the same articles, opinion pieces, editorials. . . .

    However it was interesting to note in a newspaper this morning that with number 5 in China’s “wanted” list no mention that his NZ status was granted by the Labour Government, somehow I don’t think a National government having done the same thing would receive such anomity, there would have been a “donation” found somewhere.

  • So I was watching an episode of something, and I wondered if any if you tech heads can tell me what language that is. It would have been remarkable if it had been made up just for the show, but it looks like it to me.

    • Chris EM

      That’s English, Pete. Bad grammar and diction, though.

    • wanarunna

      Wallander by any chance?

    • T Mardell

      I suspect it is Prolog, “a general-purpose logic programming language associated with artificial intelligence and computational linguistics”.

      • T Mardell

        Looking at it further, the code is parsing (analysing) data coming from a file, or from a keyboard input (was the actor hacking into the computer – hence access granted) and checking for the end of a data packet (end token) being a space or carriage return etc. What’s interesting is that the window open with the text is cropping he left hand side, yet the scroll bar looks to be all to the left. Maybe the show makers are just displaying a graphic of program text rather than the actual text in the context of a program. Easier that way to be consistent on take 2, take 3 ….

        • It is the kill switch program to hunt down a sentient virus

          X-Files S05e11

          Not too bad a story line for the age of the program.

          • T Mardell

            Prolog came about in the early 70’s in France, and is still popular today for specific tasks such as analysing large databases using rule based logic. Hence it’s choice for hunting down a sentient virus … :) Someone did their homework.

          • T Mardell
          • That’s enough now nerd boy. You’re giving us all a bad name. :P

    • metalnwood

      Yep, prolog. I did a fair bit of it back in late eighties.

      Would be happy to do some more if it was used more commercially.

      • johcar

        Maybe you should work on the X-Files??? :)

        • metalnwood

          At times, with some companies, it has felt that way.

  • KGB

    I see AC are to release new dog control measures in reaction to the latest run of attacks. I have little faith in AC getting anything right and expect some stupid decision that further punishes ‘good’ owners.
    It will no doubt include some rate-funded form of stupid education programme for children.
    I hope I’m wrong.
    All they have to do is apply current laws and prosecute EVERY owner, set a minimum sentence, and KILL every dog that causes serious harm. (No appeals)
    If housing NZ enforced their ‘no dog’ policies instead of making exceptions, we would reduce numbers by half over-night.

    • Thought: if councils charge the owner of the house where the dog resides, landlords will get really touchy, and HNZ will get a large bill every month :)

      • KGB

        That would work ?
        I think most private landlords are already there. Once upon a time rural rentals were dog-friendly, I’m told that loophole has closed:)
        A shame it’s come to this because all families should enjoy the companionship of a Lab. Not just those who can afford a house. Once again the few ruin everything for the majority.
        The difference between private tenants and HNZ tenants is affordability. Many argue that ‘it’s not fair’ because HNZ deserve the same rights. A single mother successfully argued that her special needs child needed the ‘companion staffyX’ and exceptions were made.
        If one cannot afford market rentals, then you cannot afford dog ownership. Responsible dog ownership is an expensive though rewarding luxury.

        • I can’t wait to stop renting again. I’m allowing someone in my house to have a dog, but I can’t have one! Grrr. ;)

          • RightyTighty LeftyLoosey

            Is this why you want a dog?

          • Cadwallader

            Impertinent question: Why does a snap of a monkey trying to hump a dog evoke a WO moderator’s taste for you?

        • HR

          In respect to your last paragraph I would argue the same for motor vehicles.

      • johnandali

        I heard that Housing NZ would have a representative at the meeting. But I thought that Housing NZ tenants were prohibited from having dogs, and they would be evicted if dogs were found on their premises, and that the tenants wouldn’t be allowed to apply for another state house for ….. a whole year. Or am I wrong?

  • XCIA

    I am over this “Human Rights” nonsense. It seems to me that the pendulum has swung too far in the direction of the mongrel leaving the good guys who have been aggrieved wringing their hands. Human Rights courts and commissions have truly become the last refuge for all manner of mongrels. In the latest madness, we read – “ Norway has violated the human rights of the right-wing extremist Anders Breivik by exposing him to inhuman and degrading treatment during his imprisonment for terrorism and mass murder, a Norwegian court has ruled. Breivik, who killed 77 people in July 2011 in the country’s worst acts of violence since the Second World War, took the Norwegian authorities to court last month, alleging that the solitary confinement in which he had been held for nearly five years breached the European convention on human rights. Although Breivik is detained in a three-cell complex where he can play video games, watch TV and exercise, Judge Helen Andenaes Sekulic of the Oslo district court ruled that the Norwegian state had broken article 3 of the convention.”

    • Crowgirl

      When you violate someone’s right to life, you have no more rights.

    • Mick Ie

      If any appeals fail and he does receive compensation, it should be ordered to be distributed amongst his victims families.

  • Keeping Stock

    My wife and I called into Balmoral last year when we were in Scotland, but the Queen wasn’t home. We enjoyed a look around though, and a cuppa and scone in the cafe.

    I had just celebrated my 60th birthday, and the Queen has been the reigning Monarch my entire life. Her dedication to her people, and her determination to serve until she draws her final breath is simply magnificent.

    Happy 90th birthday Your Majesty. Here’s hoping we’re both around in ten years’ time to celebrate a REALLY big birthday!

    • Tom

      I am privileged to have met the queen on 5 occasions she is a very human and caring person.

      • It’s good to have feedback like that, because the Internet told me she’s a shape shifting lizard.


        • Tom

          Well she does have a mind like a computer. last time I saw her she was presenting a new colour to my unit. She had memorized each and ever one of the 12 squadron commanders and their background, she was a pensioner then.

        • johnandali

          I was very upset this morning when the ZB news told us that it was her birthday AND that Winston Peters had said that it was time to do away with royalty. Some of our news-rooms need cleaning out.

    • Damon Mudgway

      So who gives the Queen her centenarian letter?

      • Orca

        Little George would be a nice touch.

      • Oh Please

        I wonder if she sent one to her mum in 2000.

  • Wayne Hodge

    It is intriguing to note that the NZ Herald has quite a lengthy item on the Hagaman’s considering their legal options after Little’s allegations. Yet the DomPost buries it in a small paragraph on page 2, almost as an item of no consequence.

    The Fourth Estate continues to cover itself in faecal matter.

    • Second time around

      RNZ similarly ran the line that Little was just asking the questions that need to asked. Previously I thought he had used terms like “stink to high heaven” and “corruption”, a little stronger than just quietly asking the Auditor General to have a look before pronouncing his verdict. I am not sure of the legalities, but even to defend a defamation action, Andy will need deeper pockets than the ones he shook out in public last week.

      • Sally

        Had a giggle when I saw this comment from the Hagaman’s
        “I can assure the public that for us the only thing that will ‘stink to the high heavens’ will be smell of roses which blossom from the fertiliser Andrew Little likes to spread around to gain his own notoriety.”

        • Keeping Stock

          Lani Hagamans has a lovely turn of phrase. I wonder if Mr Little is now regretting his house not being protected by a family trust.

    • R&BAvenger

      Labour have smeared the wrong people. The MSM will still try and get mileage out of the whole saga even if it is bad news for Spittle and Co.

  • sheppy

    The recorded 6am news on Paul Henry got a dose of fast forwarding this morning as I got fed up with the negativity.
    1) some poor criminal petal in Norway has had his rights breached – isn’t prison supposed to be a punishment for mass murderers?
    2) Z are not going to serve Wicked Camper Vans, no doubt because Twitter says so – last time I looked “Z” were a seller of petrol, not a morality judging service
    3) The child kidnapping / making the news branch of the media party have been released from Lebanon, after paying money by the sounds of it. Guess that’s the green light to continue breaking the law when it suits them.
    4) Some moan, about an advert for cars, at which point the FF button was pressed

    Regardless of the merit of each of these stories, put them together and it just boils down to a giant whinge fest

    • oldmanNZ

      i think some Z stations have pay at pump, so if a wicked pulls up, pay at pump, how are they going to not serve, as its self serve?

      • The CEO told us on the radio yesterday that they would see it via video link and kill the pump.

        …yeah. totally over the top.

        • kayaker

          I may stop going to Z. They might not like my personalised plate.

          • Mark

            I just emailed them,that was tricky as the “Contact” tab seems not to want to work.
            Maybe they will not serve you if you are on a road trip & make it too quickly between their stations,cops could have a pay at pump & a fine waiting, I mean the possibilities are endless,muppets.

          • Woody

            I can’t boycott them as they are already my fuel supplier of last resort owing to their pricing and yes I do have a fleet card with them but it provides almost no benefits.

        • Dave

          I worked with Mike, the CEO, when he was known as one of the Brylcream boys, the “slick” ones. I am not surprised by his move, not the most strategic, but anything for a bit of publicity.

          • Mark

            I am sure the ACC must be “Compensated” for issuing tickets for no WOF/Rego,so as a community minded biz,surely they should seek a warrant to do so also,I mean think of the children!

            Maybe Mobil should start a rumor…

            Facebook disease strikes again.

          • Aquarius 61

            Auckland Council (before amalgamation) used to have an embarrassment of riches for expired WoF/registration tickets issued; I can’t see it being any different now.

      • Tom

        If a wicked driver fills his car up are Z not going to accept payment? Seems whatever their intentions it wont work in practice.

        • Orca

          Wicked Campers do of course have the option of coming up with some hilarious anti-Z slogans to paint on their campervans. Just saying.

      • Second time around

        Most of the Wicked signs wouldn’t offend anybody, and even the offensive ones are not indecent in a legal sense. A station forecourt should serve anyone who arrives legally and is able to pay.

        • The CEO said they would serve a fully patched gang member, but not a Wicked Camper driving tourist.

          • Mark

            So they will stop selling Coke,smokes,condoms & bacon next?

          • Orca

            And if the wicked camper driver came in wearing a wicked tee-shirt and said he was a fully patched member of “Wicked Power”?

          • Oh Please

            Strange that a venue is not allowed to turn a gay wedding down, but Z can refuse to serve a bone fide customer.

  • Graham Pilgrim

    Am I right in believing that Whaleoil’s Idiot of the Week on Tuesday, (the one that abused a judge on Facebook), had his sentence reduced, and the fines he owed waived, having appealed against them on the grounds of the treatment he received from the judge in the courtroom – having to read his Facebook posts to the judge?

    • KGB

      Hours reduced from 300 to 200 on appeal due to judges reference. Fines where already wiped. Pathetic sentences in both cases. Great hourly rate for paying down debt, where do I sign up !

  • John Key @johnkeypm

    Wishing Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II a very happy 90th birthday.

    • dumbshit

      My father would have been 112 today. Considering the amount of whisky he drank, some of my older siblings thought he could never die, as he was permanently “pickled”, inside!

      • I was never ill for a single day when I was pickled 24/7.

        6 years dry in 4 days.

        • Tom

          Well done pete

          • I will take no credit now. But the first few years weren’t easy.

      • johnandali

        My old man drank too much and smoked too much – and he was 87 when he died. We put down his longevity to being smoked and pickled.

  • Isn’t Z the same crowd that was selling vegetarian pies with an ingredient made from chicken feathers?

  • LabTested

    Man has motorcycle. Man chooses not to have insurance. Man hits sheep on road (it just jumped out at him). Man has $5000 repair bill and decides to sue Sheep’s owner.

    Man puts up $500 reward for information leading to who is owner of the sheep. Then runs to the press.

    He says…….”It’s hardly fair. I didn’t do anything wrong. Surely someone would have a social conscience say it was their sheep.”


    • Damon Mudgway

      Still, if he does find the sheeps owner he does have a civil case.

      • Dave

        Not necessarily, firstly he must prove negligence, a broken fence left without being fixed, a gate left open etc.

    • Odd Ball

      I would counter sue him for the loss of the sheep, loss of profit due to the loss of the sheep, etc.

  • metalnwood

    Another ERA summary. Some of these have just been stupid. This one I am not sure about.


    So the guy was a beneficiary and apparently fired 3 days after being given the job. This was because after three days (of offer?) he asked for more time before he signed the contract. Company then tore up contract as he was not signing.

    ERA ruled he was an employee based on verbal contract. So what is the point of the contract he wasnt prepared to sign? What if he didn’t sign it, did he then have no rights as he was essentially deciding to not be an employee?

    How can you claim to be an employee when you are either contesting or not accepting your job offer?

  • Isherman

    I see the White or ‘Peace’ poppy lot are at it again this year, and being pushed by Otago University no less, who tell we need to rethink War commemorations. I’ve said before, if you want to do the ‘peace poppy’ thing, then fine, but do not hijack ANZAC day for the event, and stop trying to tell us there is something ‘wrong’ about the way we currently honour fallen service personnel, there isn’t.

  • Sagacious Blonde

    Little Andy would do well to remember Labour’s history around Bill Liu when finger pointing.
    Aside from their dubious granting of citizenship to Number 5 on the list of the World’s Most Wanted, Mr Liu’s restaurant was a major fundraising venue for Labour.

    • I’m LMAO @ Labour this week. Every day something else. Let’s see what sticks! Although this one seems to be a desperation move to get Little’s stuff-up with the Hagamans off the front page.

  • A Porirua woman has been sentenced to 12 months home detention for killing her partner during a domestic violence incident in a possible legal first.

    Mother of five, Aaliyah Tagatauli, has previously pleaded guilty to manslaughter after stabbing Mura Tagatauli in the leg last March, he later died in Wellington Hospital.

    Justice Clifford said he has not seen, or been able to find a case where manslaughter by stabbing led to a sentence of home detention.

    But he said despite the loss of a person’s life, she is not someone who needs prison, nor did she intent to kill her partner that day.

    – NZH

    • Mark

      Can’t see the headline ever reading FATHER of five.
      Meanwhile a man defending his girlfriend get convicted of fighting in public

      • This is why I never get over confident about court decisions. It may be the best system we’ve got, but there is still quite a component of “luck” on the day.

        • Mark

          I think reforming the justice system should be a high priority,starting with it’s speed,but there is plenty to reform.

          If only we had a popular Govt with a mandate for change & political capital too spend…

  • Sally

    What a lovely picture. The star is Mia Tindall holding great-grandma’s handbag.

  • R&BAvenger

    Overheard a conversation between Israeli and Iranian staff at work. Discussing how much they are enjoying living here in NZ, how peaceful and beautiful it is. Just general, getting to know each other chit chat.
    The Israeli folk mentioned about having watched videos on FB of people back in Israel, talking about the conflict. Their summary was about how much hate people on each side talk about the other, without trying to understand the other’s point of view.